This is perhaps the most horrific "alternative" quack therapy I've yet heard of...

[Dark Jaguar]

http://www.kidscomefirst.info/

Basically, if you've seen the episode of Tom Goes to the Mayor involving "rebirthing", you'll be terrified to find out it's real.

It involves restricting movement of a kid that hasn't "bonded correctly" until they submit. This restriction could be done directly by holding them down, or by wrapping the child up very tightly in a blanket, supposed to simulate the womb. From what I can see, all it's doing is terrifying the child into submission. In what way is this different than rape? Not only that, but it has proven lethal far too often, with kids suffocating and the therapists ignoring cries for help.

Tests have never shown this method to be effective at all. From what I can tell, this is just socielly acceptible torture that is synonemous with rape.

[A Black Falcon]

Yeah, I've heard about this, with some cases where the child was killed... awful...

[Great Rumbler]

I've never heard about such a technique before. Why would people think it would be a good idea?

[Dark Jaguar]

I've read a transcript of a court case involving this, and from it I gather the general attitude is a notion that rejects scientific empiricism (by empirical I don't mean the scientists order people around, I mean evidence based). The notion seems to be an extreme example of that notion that any obstacle can be overcome with sheer will, and failure to overcome an obstacle shows a lack of will. The idea of a situation that really can't be overcome (for example, falling within the horizon of a black hole, just as an extreme example) seems to be an impossibility to these mindsets. Also, the idea that such a situation is just an artificial challenge that doesn't accuratly reflect reality at all, except that some people can be cruel beyond belief, seems beyond them. What manner of evidence ever can be presented to show that such a viewpoint is correct?

http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles/history/20...wmaker.htm

Here's a link with the transript of a video used in court. It's pretty bad, so I won't quote it here.

[Great Rumbler]

Man, those people are seriously messed up in the head. Not only is birthing NOT about being courageous or wanting to live [as a baby's mental faculties have barely even begun to develop], I fail to see how wrapping a child up in a blanket and then setting on them is supposed to help ANYONE. Insane, the whole lot of them.

[Dark Jaguar]

Agreed, and top it all off with the reality that in no way was this child capable of escaping, no matter her will. A lack of courage was certainly not HER failing... The reality is, there are situations where no matter one's strength of will, they can do nothing. In the case of birth, you are right GR, it's not a matter of the baby's will, though not because they don't have the mental faculties (they don't though, just saying it's not because of it), it's because the entire birthing process, though started by a hormone release from the baby, is entirely determined from that point on by the mother's contractions. The baby doesn't "fight" it's way out, it's involuntarily pushed out!

But that aside, these were sick actions by sick people decieving themselves into thinking it was good for the child, despite a total lack of evidence of any kind to show it helpful. It's really just sickening, and the people involved got off too easy.

[Great Rumbler]

It's plain common sense that something like this would never help anyone. Something these people obviously lacked.

[Dark Jaguar]

Indeed, hurting people and depriving them of oxygen in a way they should have known about is certainly something that has stacks and stacks of scientific evidence, AGAINST! Obviously.

What really gets me is when they say things like "I'll live with this forever, a girl suffocating next to me without even knowing about it".

Oh sure, if by "without even knowing about it" you mean "she told me over and over again she couldn't breathe but I just assumed she was coping out". I guess that you can claim ignorance just by self delusion....

[Weltall]

For some odd reason this reminds me of those people selling kittens in bottles. I thought that was funny.

[Great Rumbler]

Yeah, but that was fake.

[Dark Jaguar]

Indeed, but so cute (knowing beforehand those kittens weren't forced and were just being kittens).

This however is horrific, and true, as the court cases can attest to.

[A Black Falcon]

Yes.

[Smoke]

They did an episode of Law and Order on this where the kid died and the therapist tried to cover it up. Damn, they've done an episode of Law and Order on everything.

Like so many other things this just preys upon the desperate.

[Dark Jaguar]

Therapist is a term used very loosely in this case. Basically what this tells you is that yes, it IS important to check those diplomas on the wall!

"Wait a second, this isn't a diploma!"

"Y-yes it is!"

"No, I'm pretty sure this is fly paper..."

"Um... look closer..."

"Nope, still fly paper from here too..."

"Um, maybe if you stare at it longer you'll.. WHA!" *shoves man's face into flypaper*

"Aaah! Aah! My face is stuck! Ah there's a bug in my eye!"

"That'll show you!" *hits button and wall spins around into flames.*

"Family walks in* "We were getting a little worried from the noise and... is that burning?"

"No it's just some alternative therapy I've been working on. Please, sit down."

[Darunia]

by wrapping the child up very tightly in a blanket, supposed to simulate the womb.

If anyone has seen The Jacket with Adrian Brody, that's what the movie's about... the jacket is supposed to simulate the womb. If anyone hasn't seen it, I recommend it.

[Dark Jaguar]

Nope, never heard of it. It's French isn't it?

[Great Rumbler]

No, it isn't.

[Dark Jaguar]

Well no matter, never seen it. Not sure I want to anyway. Aside from a scene involving someone being suffocated in a jacket for reasons unknown, what's it about?

[Great Rumbler]

You know, DJ, the Internet Movie Database exists for a reason. But, I'll humor you anyway since I've nothing better to do.

The film centers on a military veteran who returns to his native Vermont suffering from bouts of amnesia. When he is accused of murder and lands in an asylum, a well-meaning doctor puts him on a heavy course of experimental drugs, restrains him in a jacket-like device, and locks him away in a body drawer of the basement morgue. The process sends him on a journey into the future, where he can foresee his death (but not who did it or how) in four day's time. Now the only question that matters is: can the woman he meets in the future save him?

[Dark Jaguar]

What's the internet movie database?

[Darunia]

Succintly done GR. And again, I recommend it... and no, it's not French. It was in American theaters, how can no one else remember it?

[Great Rumbler]

What's the internet movie database?

You're kidding me right?

...

You're NOT kidding?

...

Good Lord.

...

http://www.imdb.com

The Internet Movie Database is only THE largest website dedicated to information on movies and television series on the ENTIRE internet, containing thousands and thousands of movies and televisions with cast listings, plot outlines, trivia, goofs, reviews, memorable quotes, release dates, DVD details, movie-dedicated forums, MPAA ratings, and a few more things. To have been on the internet for as long as you have, it's simply blows my mind that you've never ONCE been there much less heard of it.

[Dark Jaguar]

So? I've never once been to a LOT of web sites I'm sure. I've never been to movie message boards, for example.

I mean, the only way I could have found it is if I found a link to it. I'm not going to randomly type in "massive movie database" into google or something.

But no matter. I can just ask you guys about something. It's not like I'm putting you out or anything by doing so. I was just asking.

[Great Rumbler]

I simply find it hard to believe that you've never come across it before, seen someone post a link to it, or heard someone talking about it. It's one of the most popular website on the internet. Basically, if you want to know something about a movie or TV series you go to the Internet Movie Database. Remember: http://www.imdb.com, it's there for a reason.

[Dark Jaguar]

Money?

Anyway, what's so hard to believe about it? I just have never heard of it. I'm sure it's popular among movie goers, but I'm not really a movie buff. I just watch them. I don't seek out people to talk about them that often, and even then normally someone else has to bring it up.

[A Black Falcon]

You never have any interest in learning any information about movies? I find that hard to believe... I'm not exactly a big movie fan, but have used imdb occasionally (though it isn't good for everything because they don't have stuff like episode lists for tv shows, I believe...).

[Darunia]

The IMDB is absolutely one of the greatest and most useful websites out there. Everybody should know about it.

[Great Rumbler]

I don't seek out people to talk about them that often, and even then normally someone else has to bring it up

The Internet Movie Database is NOT a forum, though you seem to think so, it's a website dedicated to information about movies and each page [which represents a person, movie, or TV series] has, at the bottom of it, links to threads about them. It's not a forum though.

The IMDB is absolutely one of the greatest and most useful websites out there. Everybody should know about it.

Yes, it is. I go there nearly everday.

[Dark Jaguar]

No, not really... Occasionally someone will tell me I need to see such and such a movie, and I'll ask "what's it about?" and normally they just frickin' TELL me like a human being instead of giving me a hyperlink. That's about as far as it goes.

[Great Rumbler]

Haven't you ever wondered the name of an actor in a movie was? Or what year a certain movie came out? Or heard someone in passing mention the name of some movie and wondered what it was about? Or tried to remember a quote from a movie? Or tried to remember what TV show a certain actor or actress was in? That's what IMDB is for.

[Dark Jaguar]

I don't care about actor's names. I only care if they got the job done.

Also, nope, can't say I've ever had those types of questions... And, generally I don't listen in on people passing by.

[Great Rumbler]

You're so weird, DJ.

[A Black Falcon]

I've used it a couple of times for the user comments (reviews) and movie lengths, but that's about all... I find sites with episode guides of TV shows more useful for TV shows, and for movies usually I'll just watch them or not... but still, it is a good resource. :)

[Dark Jaguar]

Probably, I'm just not all that interested.

The quesion is, who maintains the data? That's the kind of stuff that interests me more than the data itself :D. Is it like a submissions based site like GameFAQs, or is it run by a couple devoted movie goers (oh sorry, they call them talkies these days now, right?).

[A Black Falcon]

User submissions.

[Great Rumbler]

The quesion is, who maintains the data? That's the kind of stuff that interests me more than the data itself . Is it like a submissions based site like GameFAQs, or is it run by a couple devoted movie goers (oh sorry, they call them talkies these days now, right?).

Why don't you go there yourself and find out! It's so easy!

http://www.imdb.com

Clicky-clicky!

[A Black Falcon]

Just because DJ wants to be difficult, of course... :)

[Great Rumbler]

Well, there's nothing new about that.

[Dark Jaguar]

What? I just thought I'd ask. From what I can tell it's you being difficult.

[A Black Falcon]

Um, DJ, when someone provides a link, the easiest way to find information about it is to click the link...

[Great Rumbler]

In fact I provided it TWICE.

[geoboy]

My God this is horrific.












That website is in desperate need of a redesign.

[Great Rumbler]

On topic?

[A Black Falcon]

Like you are?

[Great Rumbler]

Just wondering.