E3

[A Black Falcon]

OB1, there are times to fight and times to admit that you're wrong. This is one of those where you admit you're wrong. Not on everything you're saying, mind -- most of that stuff about marketing is quite true. Just about your point that PCs and consoles are in different markets.

You keep on bringing up advertising when I talk about markets.

Advertising is probably the main way that you try to reach your market... but yes, as I said, other things come into it. I was thinking as a consumer, though, and to consumers the 'how was the game designed, what processes led to its creation, etc' part doesn't get thought about much. Playing the game and advertising does that. But yeah, those other factors probably are larger.

That's because you're still confused about what I'm trying to explain to you.

The "exclusive on XBox" sticker is not for you and me. It's for the people who take up the largest percentage of the home console market, the casuals. Most of these casuals are not going to have a powerful enough gaming PC. They do not care that Doom 3 is available for the PC. What they need to know, what Microsft wants them to know, is that Doom 3 is not available for the PS2 and Gamecube, because those are the XBox's direct competion, not the PC. Without that sticker, they might wonder if they can get Doom 3 for the PS2 or GC, but with it they are certain that it can only be played on the XBox.

I don't know how much simpler I can explain this.

You just rephrased what you've been saying for several posts. I already understand that that's what you're trying to say, and my rebuttal is still the same... (and the same as other people here are saying): that label is a stupid marketing ploy. It means nothing factually. It's sole purpose is to delude some casual gamers into buying the game, when they should be looking at the PC version box and seeing if their computer is good enough.

"most people" do not have good gaming PCs. "most people" use their PCs for word and the internet. "most people" play games on home consoles, which is why console hardware and software sales are so much higher than PC ones.

My computer is not a good gaming PC anymore. After all, it's 3 1/2 years old... you don't need a massively powerful computer to play pc games. You just need an adaquate one and you need to choose your titles wisely.

Nintendogs might be a sign.

Possibly, we'll see. It's certainly a game that appeals to the masses... like Animal Crossing. Nintendo is trying. But how many causals are actually buying these games?

Really, I think Nintendogs might do better than AC in that regard, because I think that handhelds are a more "casual" gaming platform than home consoles...

You're right about one thing: the line is not magical. But there is a line, which is why there are separate markets.

Have you been listening to a single word I've said??

Listening and agreeing are different. I listen, but I do not agree. :)

Ah yes, nothing to debate here. Another magnificent rebuttal. Just like how the triforce arcade hardware is totally different from the Gamecube hardware and how F-Zero AX totally features a completely different graphic and physics engine than GX. Lazy, if you actually knew what you were talking about once in a while I just might get offended by your attempted insults.

Saying "because you've said other thing X which I think is stupid so everything you say is stupid" is a really bad debating tactic. That said, I don't know about the particulars of F-Zero AX.

PCs and consoles are so in competition it's not funny. And just like there are consoles that compete, there are countless PC manufacturers competing. But don't fool yourself for a second by thinking they are seperate markets aloof of the other. If that were so, you wouldn't see consoles trying to go online, and you wouldn't see so many PC controllers that so closely look like console controllers to play games ported from those consoles. Now, obviously Everquest will never do as well on PS2 as it has on PC, and Silent Hill will never see the success on PC that it has on consoles, but that both markets are trying so hard to incorporate the best features of their competitors into their own products is all the proof one needs to smell the competition. They are both gaming platforms. Granted, they play in slightly different ways, but saying that they are totally seperate is like saying that VCRs don't compete with DVD players, or that television doesn't compete with radio for your attention and advertising dollars. Just because the competition isn't totally direct doesn't mean it doesn't exist.

Quite definitely. Now, there's definitely a sizable market on the PC that doesn't buy console games, and wants PC-style games and not console ports, but there's lots of overlap, so saying that they are completely seperate is silly. Just say that they have their differences, more so than any two normal home consoles, but are all essentially similar gaming platforms. That's true enough.