5th February 2004, 9:15 PM
Quote:I see what you're saying ABF. First off, I should make it clear I totally agree about the difficulty of the single player campaign, in both Chaos AND Frozen. FAR too easy, well except for the timed defense levels. Those are ALWAYS hard . Now, in Chaos I can understand it not being hard until near the end, but still around halfway it should have taken a larger leap in challenge. However, Expansion Packs sold to people who already HAVE the original, so the curve of difficulty, the whole training thing, isn't needed in the least except for new features in the expansion. It almost felt like a re-training. In a sequal with the same engine, I can understand, but in an expansion, if someone isn't good enough, they can play the original campaign that they need to have anyway for the training. Frozen Throne WAS far too easy. Brood War level of challenge would have been perfect for that. Keep in mind I haven't yet completed the Orc Campaign nor have I played the game on hard mode.
Hard mode should be extra-hard, not normal. It should be a bonus for serious fans... and what they call "Normal" should be called "Easy", for sure. You shouldn't have to play Hard to get difficulty like previous Blizz games. The only actually hard levels in WC3 are the base defence ones. And yes, the expansions should be harder... TFT ISN'T! It is PITIFULLY easy. I haven't even beaten the first campaign, sure, but quit not because I was stuck but because I was bored... I don't think I've even lost a mission yet... As for RoC, it should have been like SC -- easy at first, but a nicely ramping up difficulty curve. It didn't have that. The whole thing was easy except for those two base defence missions, really. Pathetic.
And difficulty matters a lot. See, part of why SC was great was because you didn't just blow through the story at once -- you went through it slow, as you beat these challenging missions. Its kind of entertaining to just see everything happen, with no serious challenges stopping you, but it's not nearly as FUN... and as I said the single campaign to me is the most important part, even though overall I'll play more multiplayer than single.
TFT was just insulting.
Quote:As for the FMVs, I'm afraid I gotta disagree. I really didn't like the FMVs in Starcraft (original) that much at all. It wasn't quality mind you. I can look past that well enough. It was the contents. As you said, they didn't really fit in with what was going on in the story most of the time. In fact, a chunk of them were just cheesy, like that stereotypical "space hic" opening FMV. That was just pathetic really. The game certainly made up for those FMVs, and the story WAS great, but I felt the FMVs, in general mind you, hurt more than they helped. Had they just kept the story-specific ones (like the ending of the Protoss campaign) and ditched the cheesy side story stuff (like the guy who killed a zerg with his space jeep and died in classic horror movie fasion), it'd have been fine. Oh yes, I also must make it clear that I DID like the Brood War FMVs, even though there were only 4, because all of them were very well told parts of the storyline. Now as for WC3, I loved all the FMVs because they too were very well told parts of the story, this time done in the style of current day movies (as in, the acting and cinematic style used most often in movies today), also they looked great , rivaling Square-Enix in quality (which is something the FMVs in Neverwinter Nights can't say, seriously those look aweful, well for the current day's standards I mean).
Huh? SC has such cool cinematics! The Marines in the Sci Vessel is one of my favorite cinematics ever... the Dragoons blowing up the Terran base was awesome too... the opening movie to the game is also stellar... the final movie just plain rocks... and some of the short story ones are nice, like the death of Fenix... the Terrans who run over a Zergling is hilarious... the game "made up for" the cinematics? The opening cheesy? You are nuts! Yes, the Terrans are space hicks. Note their name is the Terran Confederacy, they have the stars and bars as a flag... and ingame, same -- look at the SCV! Hick! The Terrans are like that as a theme, and it's funny and appropriate given their origin as being from prison ships. I can't believe that you actually disliked the cinematics... wow... I thought they were awesome! Despite the quality of the WC3 cinematics, no way are they as cool as the SC ones. Especially if you include the BW ones, which simply blow away WC3. The BW Opening is simply amazing... and the end Terran one, the propaganda film, is probably the funniest of all the movies in SC... simply hilarous is all I can say. And the finale? They saved some of the best for last...
Oh, and SC also has greater VOLUME. Between SC and BW they have far more cinemas than WC3, far more (length-wise)...
Quote:I can see what you mean by story recycling, however I myself noticed enough differences to keep it fresh. Not like SC is original in and of itself anyway. All basic story types have already been told (in fact, if I remember from literature class, there's only 6 basic types). It's just a matter of finding ways to make it SEEM fresh and new, and mixing and matching up those basic types.
SC wasn't truly original, sure, but by that definition nothing is... it was a great story however with lots of unexpected twists and turns you never saw coming, and some you did... but the story just worked brilliantly (and was even added to later, with a few of the maps they made...). WC3 both recycled it and threw it at you at a blinding pace as you blew through the game in a matter of hours... not nearly as good, and so derivitive...
However, I must mention that I played WC3 soon after beating Planescape: Torment. I've thought ever since that this greatly colored my opinion on WC3, because Torment in story is unequalled. No PC game comes even close to it in story depth, length, amount, complexity... that game was just so amazingly, incredibly, good that a merely good story like WC3 looked pale in comparion.
Quote:Anyway, in the end it really came down to multi where I made up my mind there. Again, it's close, but multi edged out above single player. (I too value a single player experience even in this genre.)
Multi is where I'll spend more time, for sure, but I put single at least on equal footing overall. Especially for SC (well BW) and WC2, games I still haven't beaten... the single player is a huge part of those games, and is many, many hours and a lot of challenge and fun. The multi is entertaining but it doesn't tell a story and doesn't really have progression (gaining levels doesn't matter much), and that's important to me...
Quote:Warcraft IIx was way too hard when I was Younger so I would just cheat my way through it.I played it again today(without cheating) and it was a little easier suprisingly not that dificult untill half way.
Play it now. You'll see that it's still ABSURDLY hard. The second mission for each side is extremely challenging. Easily the hardest of all Blizzard's games, by a nice margin... though I haven't beaten Warcraft II either (without cheating)-- I quit on the final mission for the humans and the 12th or 13th for Orcs. It just was too hard.
Quote: I guess they picked the games they liked the most.
*wipes tears from eyes* That was the funniest thing I've read all day... thanks, Grumblie.
Hey, they did... it shows that they are extremely, extremely stupid, but they showed their intelligence level proudly to the world. :)
Quote:ASM, either you are really behind the times or you are just spouting off opinions you hear all over the net as your own to make yourself popular. Not only that, you also tend to use these cliche gamer arguments and beliefs in all the wrong places and for all the wrong reasons.
Huh? He's absolutely right... sure he's repeating things I have heard many times at Blizz fansites, but he's still mostly right if you play it much. Orcs are underpowered, even with the boost they got in TFT... TFT helped, and good Orc players can win, but they are still underpowered. And NE are too. Not to that extent, but they are... and Undead are certainly overpowered and badly need nerfing, IMO. At least vs NE... countering mass ghoul or mass skellie as NE is SO hard, it's just not fair. Humans strongest? I don't know.. they don't have any big strenths I think, but no major weaknesses, so they're good. So yes the balance isn't perfect yet. I think Blizz will improve it more over time, however. SC wasn't truly balanced until BW came out, after all...
No, it's not so bad that a newbie can't win, but there are legitimate balance issues at this point. Mocking ASM for pointing them out just says that you don't play much, DJ.