12th January 2004, 10:41 PM
(This post was last modified: 12th January 2004, 10:57 PM by A Black Falcon.)
*braces for threat move*
That would be a better point if the Japanese price wasn't the same as the European one...
I just fundamentally don't understand how you think it's fine to take facts from the home console market and transtlate them straight to the portables without any additions. As I've said many times, there are different realities and expectations in the portable market. Sony has made a product. It is a product that fits well in a specific market. That market is the group of products on the next level up from the Game Boy. It looks like a competitor to the Palms and iPods of the world, not the Game Boys, from every measure I can see.
But still you have a lot of other flaws in this post. Let's tear it apart.
I didn't say and didn't mean that. I said it wouldn't fail, and that it could succeed in some ways... but 'do great' to me implies that it would compete on an even level with the newer consoles. I don't think that. It's obviously not competition for the NGC/PS2/X-Box... and as for the GBA, it isn't if it's not a handheld which it doesn't look like it is.
Luck and great marketing. If Nintendo had ditched them two years earlier the PSX would have been just like the 3DO.
They are looking at the hardwares. The GBA-SP has greatly helped that one with older gamers. With it Nintendo finally moved the GBA into the market the PSP is aiming for... partially. I know it's stuff that people like Nokia have said, but it really is true that the GB isn't "cool" among older people... it definitely is seen as a kids toy where the major home consoles have grown up somewhat. As for adults who have GBAs I'd say that it's a more specific market that already had interest in videogames... Sony is aiming wider. They are trying to make the next Walkman. That's what they have said from the start. Oh, sure, the Walkman was just for music, but what they mean is more of this 'convergence' stuff they're pushing with their home consoles too. They want something that isn't just a game machine, it's a MP3 player and probably a PDA and several other things... if it just sold to gamers Sony would call it a failure. Actually, that's another good reason that they want to make money off the hardware... they can't rely on the PSP selling lots of games with every console for years. They got burned on the PS2 with all the people buying it for the DVD player, remember...
We drove a Yugo for our year in Yugoslavia... it wasn't quite as bad as it's reputation, I think. :)
Yes, the PSP greatly outclasses it in almost every way (read: except for price, price of games, and battery life). But those three things matter a LOT. Oh, and don't discount the next Game Boy... sure, it won't be out for a while after the PSP, but as is becoming more and more obviously clear that won't be a problem.
If the N64 ran for 12 hours before having to be recharged and the PS2 went three. And if N64 games were cheaper than PS2 games. And if the N64 before the PS2 launch had 95% of the market.
It will indeed compete with the next GB... well, either this PSP will or one of inevitable hardware revisions will... but it will compete with the GBA first and for most consumers the choice will be obvious. The PSP may look really cool, but the limitations are just prohibitive (or plain unatractive) for a handheld for most people.
Rumor? Please "read" the articles you see before you say that...
Here is the source article.
http://www.gamesindustry.biz/content_pag...w&aid=2787
Look at it. Sony Europe head... oh, then add those two paragraphs from my post a couple posts up that I got from VE3D, they were in the original paper article mentioned in that article. This is the Sony Europe head, not some nobody... and those "rumors" of the Japanese price being 48000-50000 Yen sound fairly reliable too. As I said, you're just in denial because you're a PSP fanboy.
Yes, Sony has always had low liscencing fees. The low fees on this should indeed attract developers. The Byzantine programming will repel them (I have heard rumors that it's quite hard to develop for), but that prospect of making more money off games sold than with the GBA and of Sony marketing should get developers behind it... or, at least some of them. But as I said, Sony is smart to make a profit on units sold (not a bad idea, BTW... Nintendo always does it...) in this case is definitely a smart decision. Oh, sure, $300 and $400 are different, but for handhelds... it's not that huge honestly. Most people won't spend that much for a handheld, but for the ones that will it's only a small step from one level to the next, I think... and it means a LOT to Sony's profits, which the company badly needs. And they just know that at either price they won't sell the numbers needed to make a profit anytime soon... as I said, it'll sell plenty of units up front, but the number of early adopters doesn't mean everything... just look at the N64 for proof of that...
Oh, and it leaves Nintendo with a lockhold on the children's market. The place they will be competing is adults... in that market it's less certain. Many people are used to three-hour battery lives and expensive electronics, after all... enough that the PSP will probably succeed, when you factor in the Sony marketing machine. But that market just isn't enough to take over from Game Boy. Not until they change the public's opinion on the handheld, something that I don't think will happen quickly...
Quote:Oh and I'd like to point out another flaw in your argument. Price differences between Europe and the U.S. are enormous. If a game is $50 here then it'll be £40 in the UK. Those guys don't convert straight from the dollar when they release games over there. The PS2 launched at about £250 in the UK, which is around $450.
That would be a better point if the Japanese price wasn't the same as the European one...
Quote:*sigh*
You are exactly the kind of blind, ignorant fanboy I had to deal with during the N64 days. You see ABF, the difference between you and me is that I try to remove my biases, while you're the most biased fanboy I've met since my days in Croatia. I'm more of a Nintendo fan than you are, but I do not allow myself to become deluded like you do. "The IQue would sell great here", "Sony became #1 in the industry based soley off of luck", etc. You only look like a fool, Brian.
When Sony says that the PSP will not directly compete with the GBA, they mean that as an insult towards the GBA. They're calling it a toy. Of course the PSP will not directly compete with the GBA. The GBA will be obsolete next to the PSP. It'll be like comparing a Porsche 911 to a Yugo. Like the PS2 competiting with the N64. The PSP will compete with Nintendo's next handheld, and the longer they wait before they release it the harder it will be to remain on top. I don't believe this rumor from that website. Sony didn't get on top because of blind luck, no matter how much you tell yourself that. They've always had low licensing fees, and they still manage to make big bucks with the PlayStation systems. I really can't imagine them actually trying to make a profit per handheld sold, as they know that it would never sell that well at that price point. Unless of course they've gotten cocky like Nintendo was when Sony came out of nowhere and crushed them. But I don't really believe that just yet.
I just fundamentally don't understand how you think it's fine to take facts from the home console market and transtlate them straight to the portables without any additions. As I've said many times, there are different realities and expectations in the portable market. Sony has made a product. It is a product that fits well in a specific market. That market is the group of products on the next level up from the Game Boy. It looks like a competitor to the Palms and iPods of the world, not the Game Boys, from every measure I can see.
But still you have a lot of other flaws in this post. Let's tear it apart.
Quote:"The IQue would sell great here"
I didn't say and didn't mean that. I said it wouldn't fail, and that it could succeed in some ways... but 'do great' to me implies that it would compete on an even level with the newer consoles. I don't think that. It's obviously not competition for the NGC/PS2/X-Box... and as for the GBA, it isn't if it's not a handheld which it doesn't look like it is.
Quote:"Sony became #1 in the industry based soley off of luck"
Luck and great marketing. If Nintendo had ditched them two years earlier the PSX would have been just like the 3DO.
Quote:When Sony says that the PSP will not directly compete with the GBA, they mean that as an insult towards the GBA. They're calling it a toy.
They are looking at the hardwares. The GBA-SP has greatly helped that one with older gamers. With it Nintendo finally moved the GBA into the market the PSP is aiming for... partially. I know it's stuff that people like Nokia have said, but it really is true that the GB isn't "cool" among older people... it definitely is seen as a kids toy where the major home consoles have grown up somewhat. As for adults who have GBAs I'd say that it's a more specific market that already had interest in videogames... Sony is aiming wider. They are trying to make the next Walkman. That's what they have said from the start. Oh, sure, the Walkman was just for music, but what they mean is more of this 'convergence' stuff they're pushing with their home consoles too. They want something that isn't just a game machine, it's a MP3 player and probably a PDA and several other things... if it just sold to gamers Sony would call it a failure. Actually, that's another good reason that they want to make money off the hardware... they can't rely on the PSP selling lots of games with every console for years. They got burned on the PS2 with all the people buying it for the DVD player, remember...
Quote: The GBA will be obsolete next to the PSP. It'll be like comparing a Porsche 911 to a Yugo
We drove a Yugo for our year in Yugoslavia... it wasn't quite as bad as it's reputation, I think. :)
Yes, the PSP greatly outclasses it in almost every way (read: except for price, price of games, and battery life). But those three things matter a LOT. Oh, and don't discount the next Game Boy... sure, it won't be out for a while after the PSP, but as is becoming more and more obviously clear that won't be a problem.
Quote: Like the PS2 competiting with the N64.
If the N64 ran for 12 hours before having to be recharged and the PS2 went three. And if N64 games were cheaper than PS2 games. And if the N64 before the PS2 launch had 95% of the market.
Quote:The PSP will compete with Nintendo's next handheld, and the longer they wait before they release it the harder it will be to remain on top.
It will indeed compete with the next GB... well, either this PSP will or one of inevitable hardware revisions will... but it will compete with the GBA first and for most consumers the choice will be obvious. The PSP may look really cool, but the limitations are just prohibitive (or plain unatractive) for a handheld for most people.
Quote:I don't believe this rumor from that website.
Rumor? Please "read" the articles you see before you say that...
Here is the source article.
http://www.gamesindustry.biz/content_pag...w&aid=2787
Look at it. Sony Europe head... oh, then add those two paragraphs from my post a couple posts up that I got from VE3D, they were in the original paper article mentioned in that article. This is the Sony Europe head, not some nobody... and those "rumors" of the Japanese price being 48000-50000 Yen sound fairly reliable too. As I said, you're just in denial because you're a PSP fanboy.
Quote: Sony didn't get on top because of blind luck, no matter how much you tell yourself that. They've always had low licensing fees, and they still manage to make big bucks with the PlayStation systems. I really can't imagine them actually trying to make a profit per handheld sold, as they know that it would never sell that well at that price point. Unless of course they've gotten cocky like Nintendo was when Sony came out of nowhere and crushed them. But I don't really believe that just yet.
Yes, Sony has always had low liscencing fees. The low fees on this should indeed attract developers. The Byzantine programming will repel them (I have heard rumors that it's quite hard to develop for), but that prospect of making more money off games sold than with the GBA and of Sony marketing should get developers behind it... or, at least some of them. But as I said, Sony is smart to make a profit on units sold (not a bad idea, BTW... Nintendo always does it...) in this case is definitely a smart decision. Oh, sure, $300 and $400 are different, but for handhelds... it's not that huge honestly. Most people won't spend that much for a handheld, but for the ones that will it's only a small step from one level to the next, I think... and it means a LOT to Sony's profits, which the company badly needs. And they just know that at either price they won't sell the numbers needed to make a profit anytime soon... as I said, it'll sell plenty of units up front, but the number of early adopters doesn't mean everything... just look at the N64 for proof of that...
Oh, and it leaves Nintendo with a lockhold on the children's market. The place they will be competing is adults... in that market it's less certain. Many people are used to three-hour battery lives and expensive electronics, after all... enough that the PSP will probably succeed, when you factor in the Sony marketing machine. But that market just isn't enough to take over from Game Boy. Not until they change the public's opinion on the handheld, something that I don't think will happen quickly...
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