The Official Rebel Strike Thread

[A Black Falcon]

Star Wars: Wraith Squadron would be awesome! Um, anyone read the 5th through 7th X-Wing books, which were about Wraith Squadron? They do both flying missions (like any fighter squadron) and also ground infiltration/stealthlike stuff...

Planet where Stormtroopers got trained? What was that one, Commenor? Which has a ... unpleasant encounter... with Kyp Durron in the Jedi Academy Trilogy?

[OB1]

I'd love to see a NJO game.

[A Black Falcon]

It'd be incredible if done well... (read: Don't give it to first party Lucasarts... they've been in decline since 2000...)

[Darunia]

Hows aboot a Battle of Bakura, 'eh, 'eh comrades? Get the Ssriuuvi in there. (sp.)

[A Black Falcon]

Bakura. Ssi-Ruuk Imperium. Oh, and that book (Truce at Bakura) starts literally the day after ROTJ ends.

[OB1]

That was the first SW book I ever read. But I don't think it would make for an exciting game.

[A Black Falcon]

Yeah, NJO would be much, much better.

[Darunia]

Oh, I don't know...it'd be a cool game, but they'd have to add an awful lot that wasn't in the book. Flying sorties against the Ssi-Ruuk...and it couldn't be a Rogue Squadron, 'cuz they weren't there...(were they?)

[A Black Falcon]

But the Ssi-Ruuk would be limiting... one enemy, and they beat them in one book... not especially big... but the Vong? That's a universe with about as much potential as the Classic or Prequel settings!

[Darunia]

To hell with Rogue Leader. Flight combat is so limiting. I want to see more shit with Kyle Katarn!

[OB1]

Personally I don't want to see another Jedi Knight game unless they change the gameplay. It just got so ooold...

[OB1]

...

Holy shit...


read this.

Jedi Knight III
Sun, Mar 30, 03 09:56:44 PM EST

Jedi Knight III, the sequel to the sequel to the sequel; which should technically make it the fourth, but who's counting. Well, we are, but not numbers, we're counting down to a release date! Here's the best I can do chronologically:
GameStar.de, Germany's premiere Gaming Magazine, posts next month's cover, which has a big ol Twi'lek on the cover with a Lightsaber and the title Jedi Knight III.

Fast Forward and here's what we know:

-No Kyle, you can choose between several of his students to play [among them a Twi'lek]
-Non-linear levels - pick your own missions
-bigger battles [several screenies where 6-7 jedi let it loose]
-More emphasis on the saber
-Screenshots, courtesy of JediKnightII.net
-Fall 2003 Release, currently. Don't expect this game until Early spring looking at LA current track record ;)

The best place to get all the info is over at JediKnightII.net who have been practically slaving day and night to gather everything together. And to chat about it I can't forget to mention the thread over at our Jedi Council!

...

This is scary. I just made a post about how I want to see gameplay changes in Jedi Knight 3 and just a few minutes later I go to theforce.net and find out that they announced the game as well as several major gameplay changes.

*closes eyes real hard*

I really want to see Fire Emblem come out soon!

come on....

[A Black Falcon]

Well, one piece of good news in that... they're not calling Jedi Outcast II... after their dumb stunt calling Dark Forces 3 "Jedi Knight 2" I couldn't be sure...

Anyway, it could be good... it'll be okay at least.

And I knpw its partially nostalgia, but I really do like JK1 better than JK2... other than JK2's much improved saber control (and graphics but that's not too important... for its time JK2 looks decent...), I can't think of anything that was better in the second one... the first one had a unique feel while JK2 really did feel like Quake: Lightsaber Edition... not exactly a good thing. Oh well... it was still fun, so I'm looking forward to this one...

Is it done by Raven again?

[OB1]

I assume so. I'd like to see someone else handle the development, though.

[A Black Falcon]

Yeah... Raven makes great games, but they only work with id engines and game styles... and while that worked great in, say, Star Trek Elite Force, for JK it wasn't as successful... I'd love to see them make it less like Quake and more like JK2 was, or use some new style...

And more big open levels are a must... I loved that about the JK2 engine... it wasn't strong graphically even when it came out in late 1997, but made up for it IMO with the atmosphere and size of indoor and outdoor areas... the Quake engine can do them too, but its just not as suited for big outdoor areas... but oh well. Both games are good... I'd just like to see some more changes to the game design than I bet Raven would do...

[Smoke]

Pics in this thread over at EchoBase.

Thanks goes to Hèkx Nòxú over at the LucasForums for the link.

[Darunia]

No more Kyle Katarn? But he's so cool...

Hmm...these shots look graphically to be the same as JKII...which is good and bad. I also want to see big, vast levels...and Jedi Knight I (Dark Forces 2) was simply astounding; those levels still were better than JKII. Graphics not withstanding, some of Dark Forces I were even better, for their originality. I particularly didn't like Bespin in JKII; it didn't feel like a city in the clouds at all...however, they handled Nar Shaddaa VERY well, as well as that 2nd level in the mines--(VERY NICE). Dark Forces I, however, handled somethings better still, like those cool remote Imperials bases.

[A Black Falcon]

Yeah, DF1 was a great Doom-clone... but JK was better. Lightsabers! And as for level design, yeah, both games did good level design and scale... I liked JK's better, but in most ways I'd say both of them have better levels than JK2... I just don't like Quake all that much and the DF series deserves big, open levels -- like JK had! Anyone who played the game... remember the HUGE levels? Huge, long levels where the first time through it could take you hours in some cases? Where you wandered around (with the automap on of course... otherwise you'd get lost so fast...) trying to find where to go next because so often the way forward was not clear? I loved that! Yeah, it was frusterating to be stuck without knowing where to go or what to do all the time... but it was, overall, fun... it was unique and I really liked that...

Then in JK2 the levels are a lot more standard and just don't have the size or scale of JK1 levels. Its too bad, but expected because as I said the Q3 engine just doesn't do big outdoor areas well...

[OB1]

I miss those huge outdoor levels.

[Darunia]

Really, too! I could spend hours talking about all three Dark Forces games. Let's recap the coolest levels:

In Dark Forces, they were:

--Nar Shaddaa (has there EVER been a bad NS level~!?)
--Cal-Seti spaceport
--Fest (amazing how much like in a mountain this was for 1994!)

The last level WAS SO FUCKING LONG AND HARD, that I'VE NEVER even seen the end, but once, and that was cheating!

In Jedi Knight, the coolest levels were:

--Both AWESOME Nar Shaddaa levels
--Jerec's Palace Tower (talk about VAST!)
--Both of the AWESOMELY VAST levels inside the big freighter
--The last three non-boss levels, in the valley---MIND BOGGLING!

In Jedi Outcast,

--The cool mine level (wasn't vast, but really well done)
--Nar Shaddaa!!
--One of the VAST levels in that big star destroyer, right before it detached/blew up, and it was HUGE inside, and u were way up.

Yeah, DF1 was a great Doom-clone
Whoa, far from it! Doom was the next step up...you could look up and down, jump, crouch, and there were real 3D enemies (not just sprites)! More, in DF every level was unique and distinguished.

[A Black Falcon]

I didn't get too far in DF... it was hard and the way it didn't let you save in missions got extremely frusterating... and actualy I don't have JO. After everything I heard (and playing the demo) I just don't think its worth $50... I'll get it once it goes down to $20 or maybe $30.

As for JK2, what about the expansion pack Darunia? I loved that part... the last 3 levels of the expansion (saber and force only) were so incredibly cool... the best part of both games combined no question. It was awesome... and a huge challenge. But I can't think of any truly bad levels in JK or JK: MOTS... all of them were very nice in some ways. Some of the best ones? Nar Shadaa, Jerec's Palace (the huge scale... ), and the level that was in the demo (where you go through the fuel depot and at the end jump onto that droid's big ship) were memorable. And MOTS had a lot of awesome levels even before those last 3 incredible ones... the level in Mara's ship was great, as was the 2nd level with Kyle in that asteroid.

[Darunia]

I have MOTS too (how the hell did I forget that!?), but I haven't ever beaten it...I got well into it (I forget where exactly)...at a town I think, after the pirates' ship. The first level was amazing (I got so excited to see Rebel fighters, and have Rebel troops helping me), but many of the levels seemed so amateur!

Jerec's palace was so cool... the whole game was. Another thing I don't get is why the cutscenes in JO were so crappy? In JK, they had FMV, and everything...what happened? And the story was JK was great, made you want to go on and on.

[OB1]

I'd much rather have cut scenes using the in-game engine than the terribly acted FMV from JK.

[A Black Falcon]

MOTS has 12 levels.

The first 9 are decent, but not especially great... they feel like more of the same, as you saw.

However, the last three... wow. Just wow. The best section of the whole series no question.

And yeah, the in-engine cutscenes from MOTS were a definite improvement over JK's awful FMV...

[Darunia]

ABF, HOW THE HELL CAN YOU SAY THAT!? Kyle's model in JO looks like a bird, as if it has a beak! The FMV wasn't anywhere near as bad as you make it out to be!

And OB1: I won't bother countering you, because you just disagree with me over everything by default.

[A Black Falcon]

ABF, HOW THE HELL CAN YOU SAY THAT!? Kyle's model in JO looks like a bird, as if it has a beak! The FMV wasn't anywhere near as bad as you make it out to be!

I'm confused... I don't remember mentioning JO...

[Darunia]

Oh...well I

[Darunia]

Oh...well I originally said that JO's fake cutscenes were detractive, and OB1 countered, and you did too, so. I don't remember MOTS' cutscenes...but I still think JK has the best of the series.

[OB1]

Originally posted by Darunia
ABF, HOW THE HELL CAN YOU SAY THAT!? Kyle's model in JO looks like a bird, as if it has a beak! The FMV wasn't anywhere near as bad as you make it out to be!

And OB1: I won't bother countering you, because you just disagree with me over everything by default.

The live-action FMV in JK is hilarious, which is a bad thing. The acting is really bad, the costumes are crap, and it just feels cheap. The cinemas in Outcast work much better and they could not have had Luke and Lando in the game if it were live-action. The actors look too old now.

[Darunia]

The cinemas in Outcast work much better and they could not have had Luke and Lando in the game if it were live-action. The actors look too old now.

That much is true...but I cannot stomach how poor and unrealistic the cutscenes were in JO. Even in the FMV in JK was bad, it doesn't mean that FMV will always be bad, it could've be made better for JO...just because u don't like the FMV from JK doesn't mean all FMV is terrible.

[OB1]

I prefer in-game engine cut scenes whenever the engine is good enough. And you might have turned on a setting that made the characters look weird. If you turn on self-shadowing the character faces look weird and jagged.

What kind of computer configuration did you play it on?

[Darunia]

I'm not sure, but come to think of it, you may be right...I probably did set it for low-end graphics. Why, how good were they on your comp...? REMake quality?

[OB1]

Yeah right, the Quake 3 engine? It looks pretty good though.

[A Black Falcon]

I've only played the JO demo, but of course it was at max graphic settings, and the people looked okay...

How good do they look? I don't know... nice for the Q3 engine...

And Darunia I'd VERY highly recommend (trying) to finish MOTS... it's really hard, but so great... the last level... I wandered around lost for hours... I can sort of still remember the music from it as I kept getting nowhere... which is why it was so satisfying when I finally beat it...

And MOTS had in-engine cutscenes. Given it's the JK engine you can't expect too much detail-wise, but the scale of environments (and the automap!) were awesome... way better than if it'd used a engine like the Quake games at the time had (better looking but not being able to do those key things that made JK so memorable)...

[Darunia]

I just may do that, ABF...once I geat RE0 and WW under my belt.

[OB1]

According to the Gaming-Age forums, Gamers.com leaked the title of the game and then quickly changed it to Rogue Squadron 3. Here's a short synopsis of the game, complete with the usual jab at Star Wars by a dickhead who thinks he's cool for making fun of Star Wars:

The third outing for the Rogue Squadron series and the second on Gamecube, exploring a wider variety of environments around the middle third of the Star Wars universe (you know, the one that wasn't really painfully bad) including the moons of Endor and perhaps the battle of Hoth. Development duties are handled as usual by Factor 5.

And thankfully someone at the boards copied the screen before Gamers.com fixed it:

[Darunia]

Awesome...I suppose; but do we really want it to be THAT similar to the last two. Come to think of it, is it just me or is Lucasart's GameCube contribution really limited; Rogue Leader and Jedi Outcast. I wish they'd support us like they used to.

[OB1]

You forgot to mention Bounty Hunter and Clone Wars.

[Darunia]

Ah, yes...

to recap, I suppose I'm mostly just thinking of the Indiana Jones game...and the N64 Jones game too that for some gay reason was only realeased through rental stores. Never ever put it out for sale. G-A-Y.

[OB1]

I have that Indy game. It's not bad. Definitely not as good as the recent X-Box/PC release, however.

The Gamecube is only 17 months old and there are already four SW titles available for the system compared to the five games released for the N64 during its entire lifespan, so I'd say that they're supporting Nintendo better than ever. Too bad their Outcast port sucked so badly, though.

[Darunia]

I never played it, how did it suck exactly...I wanted it for the extra bonus level.

[A Black Falcon]

Yeah, from Lucasarts we've got Star Wars Clone Wars, Bounty Hunter, Jedi Outcast, and Rogue Leader... and Gladius and now Star Wars Rebel Strike upcoming.

http://www.lucasarts.com/e3

Check back from now to E3 as Lucasarts does what they do every year -- slowly announce games on the site as it gets closer and closer to e3. No new games yet...

Oh, and the name is cool. And I don't want too many changes... the RS system works well for action/arcade flying games... I know I'd love it to be a X-Wing style simulation, but most people buying it wouldn't... :)

[OB1]

I do want the ships to have more weight to them. They felt too floaty and light in the last three games.

[A Black Falcon]

And I'd love the physics and damage models from X-Wing Alliance... while it is fun levelling fleets of TIEs and slaughtering Star Destroyers like they are paper mache, its hardly anywhere NEAR realistic for how Star Wars ships and physics and ship damage models work... sure, the X-Wing games aren't exact either, but they are a LOT closer.

Do I want a sim? No, those don't work on consoles. But a few more sim aspects, and a more realistic damage/weapon/shield control system, would be GREAT.

I mean... getting powerups is all well and good, but in Star Wars (the sims anyway) there is NO SUCH THING as a non-homing missile or torpedo. They do not exist. So why do they in Rogue Squadron? It's annoying... also stuff like, as I said, how you level fleets of TIEs so fast and kill Star Destroyers WAY WAY too easily needs to be fixed.

Oh, and I WANT X-Wing: NJO! NOW! Why is Totally Games wasting their time on a World War II game? :)

[Sacred Jellybean]

They should have ground missions, many ground missions... so I have incentive to play.

[Darunia]

I'd like to see more large-scale combat like The Battle of Endor...and fewer missions that take place in planetary atmospheres; we got way too much of that in Rogue Squadron. I want deep space combat.

[OB1]

And Ewok missions!! Haha, haven't you always wanted to play as one of those hang-gliding Ewoks from Jedi?

[A Black Falcon]

There was a Ewok sidescrolling level in Super Return of the Jedi... but yeah it'd be cool to be able to control them...

Ewok: The RTS? :)

Or how a Ewok race being added to Galactic Battlegrounds? "My glider just killed your TIE Fighter! Yeah"! :)

[OB1]

I just want to turn on my Ewok buddies during a big battle.

BTW have you thought about the new title yet? Rebel Strike. It's not Rogue anything anymore, so perhaps they're trying to stray from the vehicle-only bits? Maybe have some on-foot parts to better emulate the movies?

I'm probably wrong, but it's fun to speculate.

[A Black Falcon]

But... but... the Ewoks are good! Killing them would be evil...

I doubt there'll be some on foot parts, but maybe it'll have some player characters not in Rogue Squadron...