The Console wars who is with me?

[alien space marine]

I am in the mood for some old fasion console debating that I used to enjoy. I am sure weltall and a few others remeber.

But alot may be surprised to hear that I am a Convert of the xbox,I was a sony fanboy for atleast 3 years now. Alot of xbox fanboys in the past have been biased and dumb but I am hoping to change that.

I am gonna make a few arguements and the rest can give a few comments or contridictions and we can start a debate, Though I guess this will probaily end up as some science vs Religion flame war knowing how things go.


The Xbox is the best of the three consoles in my opinion.

games

it may be true that the Ps2 has the most games and it has always been the arguement that the xbox does not have very many games , But that is untrue.

If you go by Exclusiveness the Xbox out ways the ps2 , Microsoft has made a much stronger effort in 1st and 2nd party support.

Ps2 big crown GTA3 and VC much like many other ps2 sucesses have all been ported so their exclusiveness is pretty shallow .

I must say that Mech assault and starwars KOTOR,Halo,crimson skies and quite many more are alot more exciting then most ps2 exclusives.

Microsofts sports games beat the living shit out of the flimsy 989 ,Unlike other 2nd party sports titles they are a contender agiast EA offerings.

You cant forget MS owns Rare and they will offer a few treats soon enough.

Now lets get down to the basics , Multiplayer is really starting to become a center role in most enjoyment and value in gaming.

The Ps2 is flawed for still only having 2 slots is a backward philosophy when it comes to hardware.

While it is true you can get multi tap but the thing is , It costs money for one and most developers wont support 4 players since most people dont have it.

But having 4 ports is a luxury, This is what makes the xbox the leading contender in multiplayer experience amongst freinds.This was a big factor in why I converted and switch sides.

The Hardrive is another advantage , You dont need crappy memmory cards nore do you need pay for them.

Some games give special options like installing your own music into the games such TH underground. The Hardrive is a joy just like having 4 slots , Its better as part of the body then sold seperately.

Graphically it is better then the ps2 in alot of areas, Though alot is hype but alot of truth if you look by example.The games are better detailed and richer in textures.

[A Black Falcon]

PS2 has the most games and the best variety of games, NGC has the best exclusive games, and X-Box has PC-style games, a few exclusives, and the best online play.

Many of the best X-Box games are either PC games or PC-based games -- Midtown Madness was a PC series, Halo is on PC, KOTOR is on PC, the first Crimson Skies was a PC game, MechWarrior was a PC series, etc... X-Box is best if you like PC games (but don't want a PC), or online gaming.

But that still leaves it in third, I'd say... Sony just has more games that are worth getting because of the sheer volume on the PS2. But I'd still take the NGC first because I just like more games the Cube has.

Online... we have discussed in length here many times. :D MS is best, Sony second, Nintendo a very distant third.

[The Former DMiller]

I don't think the XSN sports series is good at all. Yes, it's better than 989, but that's like saying a piece of crap is better than a piece of shit. The Xbox is technology-wise my favorite console. The harddrive and the ability to create custom soundtracks is great. I don't think the graphics are that much better than GameCube, but the features are what I like better. PS2 certainly has the most variety of the three consoles. Every genre is well-covered while GameCube and Xbox both have their deficiencies. Xbox doesn't have too many good platformers, GameCube is weak with sports, and both have very few good RPGs. Nintendo has the best exclusive titles, but I'd put PS2 at a close second. Yes, Xbox does have Rare, but have you played Grabbed by the Gholies? I hope it isn't indicative of Rare games to come, but I'm pretty sure it's just because MS had them rush the game. I'm still looking forward to the Conker remake and possibly Perfect Dark (ETA 2015.) Right now I'd have to pick GameCube as my favorite console, but I'd put Xbox in a close second followed by PS2.

[Great Rumbler]

I'll just cover games, since everything else, in my opinion, is secondary.

What it boils down to is that it's hard to find games that can match Nintendo's. Metroid Prime, Wind Waker, Mario Sunshine, Double Dash, Mario Party 4 [ultimate party game evar], and all the others. With that in mind, although it may just be my inner fanboy, the Gamecube gets first place.

PS2 has two things, Grand Theft Auto [which is TONS of fun, even if you just drive around] and RPGs. None of the consoles can match the PS2 in that genre, which just happens to be one of my favorite. Also, the PS2 has some pretty good first/second party games, but not enough to push it to the top.

The Xbox, to me, just doesn't have that many games. Halo was just boring, although the co-op was really fun, but it does have KOTOR, which is probably one of my favorite games ever, not enough to put it anywhere but third.

[Weltall]

XBox is still a joke. Its best games are ancient PS2 ports (Having Silent Hill 2, Metal Gear Solid 2 and the GTA games is lovely, except that they were PS2-exclusive until long after people gave a damn about them), the sports games are, as Derek said, direct competition with 989, and the main exclusives tend not to interest me in the slightest.

[A Black Falcon]

Yeah, for RPGs and console-style strategy games the PS2 is the best choice... for the strategy ones it's pretty much the only choice (excepting the stuff on the GBA)... which is a boost for the PS2, definitely. And NGC has its strengths in platformers, etc... X-Box has good games for sure but it just doesn't have the top quality true exclusives (ie exclusive just to X-Box -- not X-Box and PC...) that the other consoles have. It's got a lot of the best versions of the multiplatform games (oh joy), and definitely the best multiplayer... the multiplayer is honestly the thing's biggest plus by far. I know PS2 has some too, but it's fragmented and not nearly as good in quality from what I've heard...

Oh yeah, there is a X-Box port of GTA3/Vice City out, you know, and the games are also on PC. No PS2 exclusive there anymore. :)

X-Box has just a couple of RPGs that I can think of... Morrowind and KOTOR for harder core ones (both, of course, are better on PC, especially Morrowind) and some action-RPGs (BG: DA, etc). Does it even have any menubased RPGs?

I do wish I could have an X-Box, but its exclusives lineup just isn't that strong. I mean, what third party exclusives does it have... anything other than Dead or Alive? :)

[OB1]

I've been playing my X-Box much more often than my other consoles lately (GBA not included) soley because of X-Box Live. Rainbow Six 3, Crimson Skies, PGR2, and Top Spin are an absolute blast online. No other console can compare. And Derek, if you think the XSN lineup if bad then you must not have played Top Spin yet. It's a lot like Virtua Tennis but online, which is a big plus. I don't care about most sports games so I really don't care how Fever compares to Madden. I have to give it to the X-Box for almost always having the best ports, however. If you have all three systems then you'll almost always buy the X-Box version of a big multiconsole title.

But overall I'd say that the PS2 is the best simply because of it's huge library of good games. Most of the X-Box's big titles are available on other systems (like Halo and KOTOR on the PC), and even though the Gamecube is home to most of my favorite games of this generation, big releases are relatively few and far between.

[A Black Falcon]

I haven't been doing much... some Gauntlet and some Warcraft III (I only play it with Bleakstare...) last weekend... and getting bored on the internet...

I think I might play Fallout (from my 15th Anniversary Interplay Collection), a game I never got around to starting, because of what happened to BIS, though.

[alien space marine]

Ps2 has alot of RPGs ,But I must say that the genre is stagnating and games like FFX2 didnt interest me enough to keep playing,SW KOTOR story is very unique though I wish the combat system would be a little less Simulation style and more like games like Jedi knight, But what makes KOTOR so great is the freedom to choose good and evil and custom made characters
that offers alot of replayability that I think games like FFX2 lack.
It may be true that old republic is on PC but so was the final fantasy games on the psx and I am sure you know which version had the most feed back.You cant also forget Dragon panzer orta.

The xbox bundle deal for KOTOR and Mech assualt is a good steal.

The reason I stoped supporting sony , Was the fact it seemed to me that I used my ps2 for watching movies more often then playing games, Now that I moved and have more freinds , I find I am more in the mood for multiplayer more often and the ps2 just doesnt offer the best for that.

The only ps2 games I enjoy playing was bassically games I could play on the xbox and get even better quality anyways.

The Gamecube is best for hardcore players , Nintendo still is a great company,But without Rare it doesnt have the multiplayer massvie FPS that it used too.

[alien space marine]

Originally posted by A Black Falcon

X-Box has just a couple of RPGs that I can think of... Morrowind and KOTOR for harder core ones (both, of course, are better on PC, especially Morrowind) and some action-RPGs (BG: DA, etc). Does it even have any menubased RPGs?

I do wish I could have an X-Box, but its exclusives lineup just isn't that strong. I mean, what third party exclusives does it have... anything other than Dead or Alive? :) [/B]

Panzer dragon Orta, Mech assualt ,brute force,

[The Former DMiller]

Originally posted by OB1
IAnd Derek, if you think the XSN lineup if bad then you must not have played Top Spin yet. It's a lot like Virtua Tennis but online, which is a big plus. I don't care about most sports games so I really don't care how Fever compares to Madden.

I forgot Top Spin was an XSN game. I don't care much about the online play, but it is even better gameplay-wise than Virtua Tennis. I stand by my statement, though, because the rest of the XSN games are crap.

[OB1]

Links is pretty good, despite what IGN says. It plays much more like a regular golf game than Tiger Woods does, and its online play is about two hundred times better than Woods' pathetic online mode.

[The Former DMiller]

Jeez, Links too. When I think of XSN I think of baseball, basketball, football, and hockey. Damn good games might force me to upgrade XSN from crap to less than average.

[alien space marine]

Links is much deeper more realistic golf game then Tiger woods.

You may Crap at XSN, But EA is not perfect either , They do make alot of crap piles of their own. There is a little good in every developer except 989 (cough!) (cough!)

[The Former DMiller]

But EA makes good games in the main sports which is what I generally think of when I think of a line of sports games. ESPN (Sega) is good too, and would actually have better games than EA if they could match EA's game modes and features. The problem with 989 and XSN are their main sports titles are just awful. They don't compete realism-wise with EA or Sega's games, and the features (besides online play for XSN) aren't there either.

[A Black Falcon]

Ps2 has alot of RPGs ,But I must say that the genre is stagnating and games like FFX2 didnt interest me enough to keep playing,SW KOTOR story is very unique though I wish the combat system would be a little less Simulation style and more like games like Jedi knight, But what makes KOTOR so great is the freedom to choose good and evil and custom made characters
that offers alot of replayability that I think games like FFX2 lack.
It may be true that old republic is on PC but so was the final fantasy games on the psx and I am sure you know which version had the most feed back.You cant also forget Dragon panzer orta.

:bang:

KOTOR isn't an action game! It's a deep RPG with a great and complex battle system that is based on what I think is the best RPG combat system in existence (Bioware's realtime version of D&D)... KOTOR does make it more action-ish, but going any further with it would seriously dilute the greatness of the combat and make it just another action/adventure game. Boring.

Oh, and the only FF games on PC are VII, VIII, and XI Online... and 7 and 8 were poor ports.

As for sports games, some of them are fun enough to play, but no so much that I'd actually go and buy one.

And if I were going to it would be to try to find a copy of the last version of 3DO's High Heat for PC... :)

[The Former DMiller]

Originally posted by A Black Falcon
And if I were going to it would be to try to find a copy of the last version of 3DO's High Heat for PC...

Good luck with that one. Did they even release High Heat this year? I know they canelled the console versions after 3DO went bankrupt, but I'm not sure about the PC game.

[A Black Falcon]

One can hope. :)

And if not, last year's? I mean, it's not like anything else is anywhere close as a baseball sim...

Or I could just play my ancient copy of Hardball III (sure, it's not a sim by any stretch of the imagination, but it's fun... and the announcer is funny.). :D

Hardball... that was a great series with a limp and pathetic final version (6), from Accolade, yet another now-dead company...

[OB1]

Rallisport Challenge 2 is also part of the XSN lineup, so that's three great XSN titles. :p

Amped 2 is also a part of XSN and that's at least as good as 1080, but I wouldn't call it "great".

[A Black Falcon]

I played the PC RalliSport Challenge demo... fun game.

[The Former DMiller]

Originally posted by A Black Falcon
One can hope. :)

And if not, last year's? I mean, it's not like anything else is anywhere close as a baseball sim...

Have you played All-Star Baseball? In terms of batting I think it is more realistic than High Heat, but since it uses cursor-batting a lot of people think it's less realistic. The cursor batting in ASB allows you to do pretty much anything with the bat, and it actually makes it seem just as hard as batting in the majors on the hardest difficulty level, but not in a bad way.

[The Former DMiller]

Originally posted by OB1
Rallisport Challenge 2 is also part of the XSN lineup, so that's [b]three great XSN titles. :p

Amped 2 is also a part of XSN and that's at least as good as 1080, but I wouldn't call it "great". [/B]

Well, I haven't played Rallisport, but I'll take your word for it that it's good. Here are the updated standings:

EA Sports: Pretty Good
ESPN: Fairly Good
XSN: Not Too Bad
989: Brown Pile

[OB1]

Rallisport is definitely the best rally racer out there, and the sequel should be even better.

And I don't think it's fare for you to lump all of the XSN titles into one big pile. Even though they share the same label, games like Top Spin and Rallisport really don't belong with the likes of Madden and NBA Live.

[Weltall]

I must angrily dispute you ranking 989 as a brown pile, Derek. A brown pile is one that is relatively fresh. Since 989's 2004 series games are 1997's game engines with 2001's graphics, calling it a crumbly black pile is more appropriate.

[A Black Falcon]

RalliSport is a good rally racer because it plays like an arcade racer, not a rally racer, and because the tracks are a lot more interesting than rally tracks (and many are circuits, something that aren't in real rally racers...). So it's a fun rally racer because it's not much like a real rally racer. :)

Which, IMO, is good because real rally racers bore me.

All-Star Baseball... no, haven't tried it. I've played demos of several versions of High Heat for PC, but that's about it in terms of semi-recent baseball games...

[alien space marine]

I love KOTOR , but what I meant by actionish was somtihng simular to diablo were it holds on to the RPG. I just find the fact you watch your character fight and not actually control his attacks is kind of what bores me a little bit,While there certainly is alot of strategy and really have to save alot and there is alot of ways you can so stuck you may even have to restart from scratch not that I have had to do that but pretty close on a few ocasions (untill a stocked up on alot of grenades especially plasma ones)
The reason I complain is my freind would probaily have liked it but when he first saw it he already dismissed it as just another turned based RPG.


989 is just another example of sony's poor pride in their work ,At one time the gameday series was the most advance untill they slacked off to fucking hell for quite a few years.I dont see why after so many years of being smacked by reviewers how can they even dare to release another Gameday knowing it sucks.Someone at 989 needs to stop and say.. Geez we really suck maybe we should actually try this time.

[A Black Falcon]

KOTOR is BG-style... you give your characters commands about who to attack, etc, in a complex battle mode with many options. It would not be a serious RPG if all you did is walk up to guys and mashed the attack button like you do in Diablo, and KOTOR is a serious RPG, and is far better that way...

And KOTOR is a turn-based game in a real-time shell with some turn-based stuff put on top of that. Confusing, yes? :)

[alien space marine]

No I dont mind the system , I just find that they dont give you abilities fast enough ,I am glad it isnt a Lord of the rings sort of thing.Just my complaint is that the ones who carry blasters always seem to shoot worse then my grand mother. I wonder if they did it like Zelda would things be better?

[A Black Falcon]

But KOTOR isn't Zelda or Diablo, it's a serious RPG which, unlike those games, has real RPG combat! Argh, if you want Diablo play Diablo, not KOTOR... it isn't like that and it's not supposed to be!

[OB1]

"Real" RPG combat?

[A Black Falcon]

As in strategic vs. mindless like Diablo. Menu-based combat is strategic too. :)

[alien space marine]

Their is strategy in Diablo !

KOTOR is a great game man and maybe we just have to different tastes, So The system they have now is fine as I am 3rd way through the game.

[A Black Falcon]

Yeah, Diablo does have some strategy, you are right... but not nearly as much as a harder-core RPG...

[alien space marine]

Diablo was really scary the first time I Played,All those ravaged corpses and ghoulies running around.

I wonder what Blizzard north is making now , Since they said it waisnt diablo. I hope maybe they will make Rockin roll racing 2.
We could really use a nice heavy metal music and cars spinning around .

[OB1]

I'd love to see them make a new Lost Vikings game.

[A Black Falcon]

Yeah, Rock n Roll Racing 2 would be cool, but Lost Vikings 3 would be better. I loved the first LV so much... it'd be awesome to see a sequel. So many games have copied its 'multiple characters solve puzzles' gameplay, but none have quite matched up to TLV. I'd love to see what Blizz could do with it now. But TLV really is a console-centric game, and not one I'd expect from Blizz North which so far has just made action-RPGs... maybe after SC: Ghost? :)

And I bet that Blizz North actually IS doing Diablo III.

[alien space marine]

I heard that blizzard north is burnt out of Diablo , After three games and not much else they are looking for somthing new.

I think any of the old arcade blizzard games would be nice for remaking.

I think blizzard north could do lost vikings pretty well ,You add the 3D engine toss in a little bit of RPG ,Then you advance the original Lost viking gang gameplay.

Starcraft ghost is being made by Nilithic , But what is intriguing is that blizzard has one south team not doing anything announced!
So maybe starcraft II could be soon not far away.

[A Black Falcon]

Blizz has three teams, as far as I know. North is working on an unnanounced project, while South has the RTS team working on an unnanounced project and the other team working on World of Warcraft... and, I'm sure, a few guys helping Nihilistic.

I bet the RTS guys are doing SC2 now... but that's just what I hope. :) Who knows what they're actually doing.

[alien space marine]

Was the starcraft units in warcraft III any hint?

Somthing I hope for is formations and a formation editor, I would love to pull blitz'kreg and panzer attacks in starcraft.I hope they make it a large scale combat with maybe only some bonus Command units but nothing like warcraft III.

[A Black Falcon]

I love War3's small unit tactics focus... it works really great in the game. However, in SC that wouldn't be as good. It might work, fine, but SC really is about bigger numbers of troops, so yes, I would want a much higher unit limit. Heroes... heroes were a great, great addition to War3. They might want to tone them down or something for SC2 because of how they'll have to do a large-unit tactics game, but they might well get them to work... and how about creeps? I'm not sure about those, either... maybe. All I know is whatever decisions Blizz makes, they will be good ones. :)

[alien space marine]

If anyone can do it , Blizzard can!