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AAAHHHHHHHHHHH! REAL TIMELINE! - Dark Jaguar - 27th December 2011
I present to you an OFFICIAL timeline published in a Nintendo artbook overseen by Eiji Aonuma.
According to this, there are in fact 3 different timeline splits all coming from Ocarina of Time.
Further, this timeline is simply perfect. I can find no flaws in it. It incorporates every last detail we've been told by the official channels over the decades about the chronology, excepting the temporal hiccup that was the Zelda official web site in early 2000 (which no one took seriously anyway). Better yet, it puts the Oracle games and Link's Awakening in their proper place. It seems that the Oracle games took place after Link to the Past (using the same Link), and that same Link went on to do Link's Awakening (which was the original official statement on when that took place anyway). Then a "golden age" happens, followed by the "age of decline" with Zelda 1 and 2. That whole timeline from LTTP onward is the timeline where Link fails in his mission and Ganon is apparently imprisoned during a much more devastating massive war (the imprisoning war that LTTP mentions during the prologue). In fact I think that "failed in his mission" split happened at the exact moment Young Link entered the Temple of Time and grabbed the Master Sword. He was taken out of his world during that time, and I think that event would create a split where he never returned in one line (thus failing) and returned to defeat Ganon in the other, thus leading to the third where he was able to go back and prevent Ganon from coming to power to begin with.
I was confused about Four Swords Adventures for some time because it seemed odd that Ganon would come to power BEFORE OOT and be sealed in the sword with no explanation of how he escaped. Well, this explains it. Apparently when he died in Twilight Princess, he later got reincarnated along with Vaati years later, and that's where Four Swords + stands. For that matter, it explains why there is a dark world in that game. Majora's Mask of course takes place after OOT, though it doesn't mention that that whole game took place with Link travelling to an alternate reality. That's incidental though and doesn't affect the timeline.
Haha! It even notes where the "Tragedy of Princess Zelda the 1st" (described in the Zelda II manual) happens. Apparently that marked the end of the Golden Era, and so apparently during that time princesses stopped being named Zelda until that incident.
<img src="http://www.glitterberri.com/content/zelda_series/hyrule_historia/timeline.png">
So where do the CD-i games fit in all this?
AAAHHHHHHHHHHH! REAL TIMELINE! - Great Rumbler - 27th December 2011
There is no timeline, just a lot of justifications for things that don't logically fit.
AAAHHHHHHHHHHH! REAL TIMELINE! - Dark Jaguar - 27th December 2011
See post 1. There it is. It's directly from Nintendo. It all fits perfectly near as I can tell. Further, Nintendo has been stating things about the timeline for a LONG time now. They've made an announcement of one form or another just before the launch of every Zelda game explaining where it fits. The game themselves specifically refer to the events of other games constantly. By your logic there is no connection between Zelda 1 and 2 or OOT and MM or LTTP and OOT or WW and OOT or Twilight Princess and OOT. Does that make sense to you? Before they revealed the split timeline, a lot of it didn't make sense. Now it does. The biggest problem were those Capcom Zelda games, but they've fit in there very well. The Oracle games being right after LTTP makes perfect sense, explaining why Link could just "visit" the triforce, and LA being after those makes sense too. I've often chocked up the "imprisoning war" being depicted as a massive army in LTTP instead of what OOT shows ,a lone hero, as the "mists of time" changing the legend. However, this timeline shows that the split that leads to LTTP DOES in fact have a massive army as the hero fails in that version of events.
Really, can you identify even one problem with the timeline above? Really the only obvious thing is that the timeline is not set up as an exact scale of the amount of time between events. That's left up to our imaginations.
Actually, there are a few things that are odd but don't hurt the overall timeline. The Sages in OOT are clearly the ancestors of the maidens you rescue in LTTP. That's established very clearly in OOT. The confusion is this. How does a fish, a forest nymph, a rock eater, a ninja, and an arab eventually lead to human descendants? I guess I'll not worry about the details of the genetics, the point is that's clearly the timeline of events that was intended between those two games. One other detail is between Minish Cap and Four Swords. In Four Swords Vaati is said to have kidnapped "many maidens" in the past, but in playing Minish Cap, the only maiden he ever kidnaps is Zelda, and only Link seems to realize that's what happened. The townspeople are ignorant of it. How'd he get that reputation? Again though, this is a plot hole within Minish Cap, not in the overall timeline. Minish Cap was created at the outset, and it's clear in the game, to be meant to take place before Four Swords.
AAAHHHHHHHHHHH! REAL TIMELINE! - Weltall - 27th December 2011
There are a few things about it which I find odd.
I guess I can reconcile the LTTP timeline following a Game Over for OOT, though I like better the idea that the 'imprisoning war' was fought in the interim between OOT Link's childhood and adulthood, and that it was at least partially mythical in its portrayal of events and that Link was simply lost to that myth, as has probably happened in any number of real historical events in which concrete details are lacking. This version of canon works, but it kind of sucks that the games with which most of us are most familiar branch off Link being defeated in OOT.
The real confusing item is how Four Swords has Ganondorf resurrected in a timeline which basically renders Ganondorf irrelevant, as his rise to power was cut short before it really began. Why would anybody bother resurrecting an anonymous loser?
AAAHHHHHHHHHHH! REAL TIMELINE! - Dark Jaguar - 27th December 2011
You mean Four Swords Adventure? Well, he did nearly destroy the entire kingdom in Twilight Princess before the events of Four Sword Adventure. He'd have infamy from that I would imagine.
However, in Four Swords Adventure he isn't resurrected so much as reincarnated, so fame doesn't really factor into it. In fact no one really knows who he is until he takes the Trident of Destruction. It's notable that he's not focusing on the Triforce in that game though, and that the Four Sword comes back into focus.
Honestly the "mists of time" thing is how I saw it too, and yeah it is a little odd to think of Link losing leading to the first game in the series. It's actually a very dark timeline in that way. If my interpretation of when the "he lost" took place is right (the split happens at the very moment Link touches the Master Sword for the first time as a child), that means that there's a timeline where the Deku Tree, Zelda, Kaopora Gaobora, and countless others put all their faith into the child of legend, everything in place for the moment that kid will become the hero, and that child of legend promptly vanishes without a trace instead of saving the world in any way. That's frickin' DARK. In fact, if they make a Zelda MMO, THAT is the period of time when it would take place.
However, it does help solidify the Oracle games in their spot in the timeline. If Hero of Time Link failed, then the Twinrova sisters were never killed, and so that leaves them free to work in the background for eons to resurrect Ganon (I'd imagine witches live for a long time, given the two witches' comments about their age in OOT).
Really the biggest problem I have working it out that way is that I always connected Ganon's comments at the very end of OOT (saying he'll get revenge on Link, Zelda, and the Sage's descendants) as specifically foreshadowing his later abduction of all the sage descendants in LTTP. Since that's the "adult" timeline, it no longer foreshadows LTTP's events at all, but rather Wind Waker's events (which simply isn't as good a fit, since there are fewer descendants for him to get revenge on in that game). The only way it still "works" is if we imagine he said that when he was finally imprisoned in the imprisoning war timeline as well.
It fits perfectly in the timeline, just not from my perspective on how good the foreshadowing and "self referencing the previous game" of that line of dialog was.
AAAHHHHHHHHHHH! REAL TIMELINE! - Dark Jaguar - 28th December 2011
I was thinking a few more things. With the Link defeated time line, it makes even more sense because that explains why Volvagia is alive in Zelda 2.
I was also thinking something else. Termina in Majora's Mask is supposed to be a completely separate alternate reality from any of these timelines. In theory, any of these Links could travel to Termina and find out about the alternate timeline Links via their history. That could get confusing, or fun. In fact, here's an idea. Take Link as he was at the end of Majora's Mask, make him a villain corrupted by the Fierce Deity Mask, and ages later have, say, Link from Zelda 1 have to come in and save him from himself. Well, yeah it's actually just a rip off of the plot of Majora's Mask... I dunno I though it was interesting for a sec, what do you want from me?
AAAHHHHHHHHHHH! REAL TIMELINE! - A Black Falcon - 30th December 2011
Quote:Actually, there are a few things that are odd but don't hurt the overall timeline. The Sages in OOT are clearly the ancestors of the maidens you rescue in LTTP. That's established very clearly in OOT. The confusion is this. How does a fish, a forest nymph, a rock eater, a ninja, and an arab eventually lead to human descendants?
The idea is that the LttP timeline is one where Link fails to defeat Ganon in OoT, so instead some sages later on have to seal him... and apparently they're not the ones from that game, but a group of Hyrulean ones or something. I don't know, it's pretty sketchy for sure, but something like that is the excuse.
Quote:Really the biggest problem I have working it out that way is that I always connected Ganon's comments at the very end of OOT (saying he'll get revenge on Link, Zelda, and the Sage's descendants) as specifically foreshadowing his later abduction of all the sage descendants in LTTP. Since that's the "adult" timeline, it no longer foreshadows LTTP's events at all, but rather Wind Waker's events (which simply isn't as good a fit, since there are fewer descendants for him to get revenge on in that game). The only way it still "works" is if we imagine he said that when he was finally imprisoned in the imprisoning war timeline as well.I agree. While adding a third timeline can make sense as far as timelines go, it's fairly unsatisfying in some other ways, both in how it adds a "you failed in OoT" ending, apparently, and in this... OoT sure looked like it was designed as an LttP backstory, and now they're revoking that, seemingly, because the stories don't exactly match up? Either they'd actually been thinking this all along, or this is rewriting the story after the fact for sure...
Even so though, it is very nice to actually see a real, official timeline, and it does follow and make sense, which is great.
AAAHHHHHHHHHHH! REAL TIMELINE! - Dark Jaguar - 30th December 2011
So I suppose your idea is the original sages are never "awakened" but are killed, and their sage powers end up transferring to compatible candidates a generation later during the imprisoning war? That's interesting in and of itself, but it does present a problem. All the towns in Zelda 2 are named after those sages (also Mido), which doesn't make sense if they died in obscurity in the imprisoning war.
AAAHHHHHHHHHHH! REAL TIMELINE! - Dark Jaguar - 3rd January 2012
This one should satisfy GR.
<img src="http://s3.amazonaws.com/data.tumblr.com/tumblr_lx6n4xAu3c1qizbpto1_1280.jpg?AWSAccessKeyId=AKIAJ6IHWSU3BX3X7X3Q&Expires=1325709955&Signature=rh%2Buw%2Fm2zyi1PeA0SxbpYmT9%2BZ8%3D">
All those time lines converge in THE THIRD DIMENSION to form live-action Zelda's Adventure. After that, Link travels to the alternate world of SOUL EDGE and fights Inferno, unless Spawn or Yoda do.
AAAHHHHHHHHHHH! REAL TIMELINE! - A Black Falcon - 3rd January 2012
The "Good" and "Okay" labels are backwards in that list though... should be the other way around. :)
Quote:So I suppose your idea is the original sages are never "awakened" but are killed, and their sage powers end up transferring to compatible candidates a generation later during the imprisoning war? That's interesting in and of itself, but it does present a problem. All the towns in Zelda 2 are named after those sages (also Mido), which doesn't make sense if they died in obscurity in the imprisoning war.Well, only Link had to actually die; the other sages didn't necessarily have to die right there. You're right that the towns in AoL being named after the sages wouldn't make sense if those sages hadn't been important, though, and if it was actually other sages that saved the day in that timeline, as it would probably have to be, I'm not sure what the solution there is really... it is a potential issue with the timeline. Unless the other sages just happened to have the same names or something, but that'd be stupid even for Zelda.
I'm sure it'd be possible to come up with an excuse (um, those sages were still important but weren't the ones that actually sealed him, or something), but yeah, I'm not sure what the answer is.
AAAHHHHHHHHHHH! REAL TIMELINE! - etoven - 3rd January 2012
I say bully on this penis cock endeavor.. BULLY! x 2 dildos and a matchstick.
AAAHHHHHHHHHHH! REAL TIMELINE! - Dark Jaguar - 3rd January 2012
So what we do know is that Link had to have at least gotten as far as opening the Temple of Time door, or else Ganondorf would have just stuck around wondering how he'd open the thing rather than causing a war. This presents the most unsettling aspect, the part that I think was bothering me most about this new time line. Link doomed the world instead of saving it.