Great Rumbler Wrote:I don't know about "tactical genius", but he definitely knew how to rally people around him and make the populace believe whatever he wanted them to believe.

Weltall Wrote:I never knew anyone to consider Hitler a tactical genius, considering that it was his biggest shortcoming as Nazi Overlord. By about three hundred miles.

I think Germany could have beaten the Soviets if three conditions were met:

1: Contain Britain as opposed to attempting an invasion. Britain could never invade the mainland by itself and was effectively neutered by mid-1940.

2: Concentrate forces more efficiently during Barbarossa and strike fast and hard directly at Moscow. A bureaucratic monstrosity such as Soviet Russia would be wrecked by the loss of its government (as much of it stuck around even when the Germans actually got within sight of the city). That would give the unified German forces time enough to secure much of western Russia, where most of the industry and population centers were.

3: Don't declare war on the United Fucking States of America just because Japan wanted to scrap with them. This was probably the worst mistake Hitler made, because it suddenly opened up worlds of possibility for a badly-beleaguered Allied force. The alternative was alienating an ally half a world away and of practically zero tactical importance.

It's a new thing lately to agree with the long-held Russian conceit that they could have handled Hitler by themselves, but the fact is that they only barely managed to do that even with the much-smaller German forces divided ultimately into three parts. They had the U.S.A. not only supplying the majority of two extra fronts, but the Soviets also relied heavily on American-subsidized equipment and matériel, as the Germans had effectively wrecked much of the Soviet's native manufacturing capacity.

The world tends to get upset when America reminds everyone that we won that war, but it's true. America turned the tide in Europe. While fighting a major war against Japan in the Pacific. By themselves. And all that without total mobilization and from a great geographical distance on both ends.

Maybe some people get tired of hearing it, but I don't. When it came to the second world war, America was totally fucking bad ass. :FuckYou:

alien space marine Wrote:Unfortunately many Americans get so boastful and smug about it that it annoys the hell out of everyone, Winning the war was a team effort after all.

alien space marine Wrote:Unfortunately many Americans get so boastful and smug about it that it annoys the hell out of everyone, Winning the war was a team effort after all.

lazyfatbum Wrote:This will sound bad but in simple terms we did most of the work and Russia swooped in at the last day, literally. They claimed victory and thus began the cold war. It was a victory for humanity but a bitter sweet one politically. America has never won a war on its own unless you count the civil war, but even then... we depend on our allies.

Germany didn't need allies, Japan was a front, a red herring to draw attention. By the time the Nippon people had realized it, they had already turned their back to their old ways and leader.

Hitler was a single man who said lets take over the world and all he had to do was make a friend of America or keep us out of his territories until he could do exactly what we did to Japan, scare us in to submission, then be drawn and organized in to aryan groups. His belief was that if you can mold one generation, one city, one school of children, you will have an army in less than two decades and they'll agree to it because you promise them everything and deliver. What's a little genocide and crimes against humanity when we're talking about creating an empire of perfection and wealth, no quarrels of religion, no war, no conflict, no crime, one language, one race under God.

North Korea with the money and strength of Europe, it would have been what Rome only hoped to be, but in a circus-like prison of damnation and guilt, a bastardized vision of peace and he was so close to doing it that all governments, all political leaders know and fear the possibility of a single man creating the same proverbial drop in the ocean. Even with today's technology, in today's world, we all wonder if there will be another Nazi Germany rising. I'm not talking about some country hick who shaves his head and thinks he's aryan, i'm talking about leader in the asian territories or middle eastern who decides they want to give it a shot - all you'd need is the threat of nuclear warfare. With that alone, you can create your own empire, sacrificing your ties to the world.

Darunia Wrote:Haha... poor little Canada. Canada's presence was token, and unless I'm very much mistaken almost entirely European. And what of Canada's contributions to the Battle of Midway and Leyte Gulf... the Pacific war was the US v. Japan, with bit contributions from Britain and Australia (i.e. very minute.) Europe was the US in concert with Britain and Russia... and a little bit of all the occupied countries, but theirs was not what I would call entirely necessary. True, they helped, but it's not like the US and Britain would have been swept off of Normandy if the Canadian's hadn't arrived. America was the Arsenal of Democracy. And Canada was the Arsenal's hat.

alien space marine Wrote:Canada was threatened , German submarines were sinking ships in our harbor to stop relief aid to Britain, At that time a declaration of war on Britain was a declaration of war on all of its dominions around the globe.

The Canada vs America thing is silly , It might provide amusement but its holly inappropriate to belittle any of the young men in uniform who gave everything in ww2.

Unreadphilosophy Wrote:What I find interesting regarding both World Wars and Hitler's rise to power is the complete ignorance and filtering that mainstream history does regarding America's banking elites in their connection to these acts. I'm specifically talking about J.P Morgan and the Rockefeller family. And, no, what I'm talking about is not a conspiracy theory. I can back-up what I'm talking about with historical facts. Would you guys like me to tell you what I've researched?

Darunia Wrote:If Canada hadn't liberated the Netherlands, do you think it would still be under Axis control today? Just like Paris was "liberated by France".... it's not like they unilaterally took it over. I enjoy this dichotomy of Canada... they love being peaceful and cozy and socialist and hate us for being machismo and domineering, and then they desperately try to trumpet up what little bit of military history they do have. Whatever percentage of Canadians that did serve, while it cannot be argued that they did not fight well, and they did help the effort, was not so important that they could not have been done without. Any more than other token countries (or dominions of real countries) were essential to the war effort. What do you all think, do you think we could have swung it without the help of Denmark? Or Greece? I'm sure if you talk to them, they'll be trumpeting up their merits... but let's be frank. If sometimes America is prone to boast of itself, this is one time where nobody can blame us. WWII was won by the United States, Russia and Britain. Others helped, but the fact that the US and not Canada sits on the UN security council (bear in mind that all the major victorious world powers of the day were there seated) must be telling.Thus, they were token: the war would've been won with or without them. The same with a score of other lesser powers. Just like Paris didn't have to be re-taken by the French--that was allowed to happen by Allied planning.

Don't forget other famous Americans with Nazi ties, like Henry Ford and Charles Lindbergh! Well, I'm sure there are plenty of famous Canadians who had Nazi ties, too! Just make a list of world-famous Canadians from the 40s, like... like.... hmm... there's got to be at least one... no, I guess not.


Don't feel bad, Canada, we love you just the way you are, all cute! You're a cute little Canada, aren't ya? Aren't ya! Haha ya... there's that smile. Good Canada. Now go back to hockey and maple syrup.

And ASM--did I catch you riffing America for being isolationist in the 30s and 1940? Really? But, if we attack a country like Iraq, under similar suspicions of preventative action in advance of trouble ahead, we're war-mongers?