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+--- Thread: DNA=Badly written programming code (/showthread.php?tid=3673)
DNA=Badly written programming code - Dark Jaguar - 18th April 2006
Well, I've been watching some stuff about programming code and have found some amazing discoveries. Basically, there is a lot of total garbage code in our DNA, and a lot of the "programming" seems to actually be very messy.
Here's an example. There's been a discovery regarding an allele that has to do with clotting (an allele can be likened to the "bit" of the genetic world, many of them will make up a single gene). The discovery is what it actually does. It doesn't actually cause clotting, but rather it turns off another allele. That allele doesn't cause clotting itself, but rather it turns off something needed for clotting to function. Essentially, if this was written code, it would be something like this:
ClotStatus=0
ClotStatus=1
That's a very basic way of putting it, but it is dirty and wasteful code. A lot of discoveries like this make it very clear. Humans make much better programmers than nature :D. Hey, give US a few billion years we should be able to debug that DNA.
There are also lots of left over messy bits from bad transcriptions. For example, there are a number of broken bits of alleles in our genes that corrospond with really old virus...es that got passed down over the generations, and of course the unused bits of leftover code from our genetic ancestors.
All in all, it's that "survival of the just good enough" thing again. DNA isn't clean, but it gets the job done. We'll see how smoothly it runs if we can debug it.
DNA=Badly written programming code - Great Rumbler - 18th April 2006
It's gotten us this far.
DNA=Badly written programming code - etoven - 18th April 2006
If my body EVER! becomes powered by windows vista 2003, I'll be forced to forced to glock every 3rd persion at microsoft starting with Mr Gates and ending with the company cat.
DNA=Badly written programming code - The Former DMiller - 18th April 2006
Don't you mean Windows Vista 2009?
DNA=Badly written programming code - A Black Falcon - 18th April 2006
Vista will be out that soon? :)
DNA=Badly written programming code - Dark Jaguar - 19th April 2006
Great Rumbler Wrote:It's gotten us this far.
Clearly. It has also gotten us cancer, birth defects, and a miriad of genetic diseases such as progeria, nature's cruelest joke. Hence why evolution is more accuratly described as "survival of the just good enough". Are you saying there isn't large room for improvement, and glaring design flaws in our structure?
DNA=Badly written programming code - lazyfatbum - 19th April 2006
based on what i know so far its that transmutagenic property that makes lifeforms so pliable and easily transformed to best fit any given situation, low food, extreme weather changes, etc. If the DNA were "clean" we would essentially stop evolving as there would be nothing to jump to in the pool. We would be perfect human beings but we would go beyond where we are now.
that said, there's a billion problems with our DNA specifically because we're the only living thing that takes care of its gentically defunct, if a couple has a retarded infant (either physically or mentally on any given level) the infant is still raised and nurtured and taught to find a mate and even have children, etc. this could be as simple as someone born who is legally blind but can still see somewhat. he or she just needs glasses; In the wild they'd be dead in a few weeks but with human beings they can lead a full happy life and have children who will either have the same defect or carry the genes of that defect and so and so on with every retardation or defect you can think of. In the wild world, any such defects are avoided, no one wants to have a baby with someone who was born with one leg or born mentally retarded or especially with poor vision, so their gene pools stay cleaner.
The inverse of that is that is that in the code of lions for example, they make sure to keep it clean but in that idea, they retain all the gene material of anything that worked in the past. So if a cold climate approaches and hinders hunting ability or its just too cold to live the DNA will reactivate during gestation and turn certain aminos on that were once dorment because it will recognize the need on a cellular level. Just like your hands get callouses after working hard for a day, your body adapts instantly as best as it can, over time if an entire race of people worked hard with their hands every day it would introduce old genes to make the hands stronger since its need is litteraly noticed by every cell of the body in the parents, so it transfers. So the first cubs that are born in the cold enviroment wont look that much different, but after a few generations in a very short time span they'll be very well adapted because they did it before. It's devolution and alot of animals have used it already in our recorded science, like those weird mantids that just evolve wings when they need it every few thousand generations if the population gets too low, so they can spread further and find more of their kind to mate. the mantid DNA actually recognizes that the number of mantids is getting smaller every year (smaller gene pool) so suddenly the next generation of infant mantids have wings
in human beings, we're so dirty because of our need to protect our children (even if they would be better off dead as sad as that is), that we get birth defects, cancers, internally manifested viruses and even time-coded problems where you just suddenly have a bad heart out of nowhere because a certain gene cant function correctly. Wild animals have no such problems because they dont have the luxury of giving a higher survivability rate to someone in their group becauuse of a defect, they're just left to die or let to live with the inability to protect or sustain itself, which makes the gene pool very, very strong.
DNA=Badly written programming code - Dark Jaguar - 19th April 2006
At this point in time, we may be ready to basically "take over" our evolution. Random chance got us this far, but it's far too clunky and slow to work at this point, so if we are capable of it, we should take over. So in other words, your argument that if we clean up our code, there won't be a lot of extra genes to accidently mutate in various ways is sort of pointless, since we won't exactly be depending on that any more once we get started. When an environmental stress occurs, we'll be able to far more quickly and intelligently design a solution, rather than blindly hoping some change will be able to save us many generations from then.
Outdated programming methods are replaced all the time. Our DNA is no different. Keeping "legacy" code we'll really have no reason to use is pointless. On the other hand, if our intention is to seed another world with life and allow it to evolve the old fasioned way, then keeping "dirty code" may very well be needed.
DNA=Badly written programming code - Great Rumbler - 19th April 2006
Gattaca...
DNA=Badly written programming code - lazyfatbum - 19th April 2006
haha that was a good movie but the homosexual overtones made me feel like i was watching a skit on Kids in the hall.
DJ I think with DNA as with all DNA in the world of furry/scaly/veggie things is best left alone. We haven't figured it all out yet and just barely scratched the surface of most of its use or reasons. And if you remove the 'junk' you dismantle millions of years of evolution which even our best scientists and computers cannot understand or predict or even solidify as a just cause. It's like when people remove a part from a car saying that it doesn't need it, it was there for a reason. Its like when they thought that peneal gland in the brain was useless and then oops, hey it makes melatonin and without it you go insane and die, our bad. oh, but the appendix can go, yeah they're worthless, oops hey they might secrete hormones... oh but who needs hormones, yay! *everyone retards in to a state of palpate*
DNA=Badly written programming code - Great Rumbler - 19th April 2006
Quote:haha that was a good movie but the homosexual overtones made me feel like i was watching a skit on Kids in the hall.
I didn't notice anything like that...
DNA=Badly written programming code - Dark Jaguar - 19th April 2006
That's why they are still experimenting with it, to find out what purpose it all has, and so far there do seem to be large chunks that have simply been "carried over" all this time but serve no purpose, or parts that are simply badly coded that could be coded better. What's the point in code that turns off a gene that turns off another when you could just get rid of both?
DNA=Badly written programming code - lazyfatbum - 20th April 2006
Didn't you read Jurassic Park? BILLIONS of code man! ***billions*** in EACH nucleotide! :D I think anyways, of which there are BILLIONS as well and each and every code or signal is just as important as the last, I mean while you might find a a bad code you'd have to remove it on a molecular level without disturbing the rest of the nucleotide (which I think form in threes, each containing billions of code). so if you pop one off, the other two will probably deform and attach to other cells (creating massive retardation) or just float and become useless and you just removed the genome that allows for the production of neurons during gestation which means you cant have kids ever - poof there goes your heritage, I mean that's how fragile it is. I'm sure in 50 to 100 years we're gonna be able to deform the sugars and aminos in advanced gene therapy to remove something disasterous (like a strain of code that carries cancer, or blocked/self-destructive code), can totally see that happening. But not willy-nilly hey lets make our selves perfect when we have no idea what that even means, oops my son cant form a backbone because I wanted thicker hair, yunno? All bad.
I think what's important for people to realize is that we are perfect right now. Unfortunately we eat fast food which actually compoounded chemicals that resemble food, subject ourselves to bizzare often man-made toxins, hell did you know that if you eat chocolate over a period of 20 to 30 years you can actually alter some of your DNA? or being exposed to various types of radiation from televisions to radio waves and just owning a microwave in your house or not recieving enough melatonin during sleep cycles because we dont sleep in absolute blackness, etc all of that can cause slight retardation in the genome and it's all 100% avoidable. So I think we'lll become a healthier animal as a way to prevent disease/perpeuation of disease/retardation before we actually start playing with the single most important aspect of all life on earth.
wiki's got fun stuff about DNA and I think my knowledge of it is pretty up to date but i'm reading through it now, section 9 has a whole thing on the first seperation and discovery which is neat. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DNA
DNA=Badly written programming code - Laser Link - 20th April 2006
I've found working in the programming industry for 2 years and writing code with students for 4, that when people complain about someone's code, there are 2 reasons.
1) The code really is bad, and it could have been improved upon to increase functionality and clarity
2) The complainer just really doesn't understand what the code is doing. This tends to be because they don't really even get what the code is <b>supposed</b> to be doing, but they are arrogant and assume they know exactly what is going on.
Guess which is much more common?
DNA=Badly written programming code - The Former DMiller - 20th April 2006
Oooh, oooh, I know! It's 2! What do I win?
DNA=Badly written programming code - Dark Jaguar - 20th April 2006
Yeah, I know, but so far evidence doesn't show that that's the case. So far all the evidence points to DNA being nature's equivilent of spagetti code.
DNA=Badly written programming code - Great Rumbler - 20th April 2006
Yeah! And the cloning of animals is an astounding success! Oh wait...Dolly the sheep died at half the normal age for a sheep due to a fatal type of cancer. Oops.
DNA=Badly written programming code - lazyfatbum - 21st April 2006
hahahaha :D
Scientist: We cloned a sheep!
Sheep: *dies*
Scientist: fuck. let's make another!
Sheep: *dies*
Scientist: fuck! what is up with this code??
Sheep watching through the window: i dont see the big deal, Nancy pops one out every few months and they do fine.
Nancy the sheep: wat! r u calling me a slut??/
*somewhere in heaven billions of years ago*
God: I did it! i made a lifeform! it's kinda slimey.... but it's alive! Hmm.... I cant hand-make every single lifeform I need to make them perpetuate somehow...
Michael: ....make them horny
God: Oh yeah! hey someone write this down; hence forth, the life of earth will be unbelievably horny and total sluts
Michael: ok but what if they get really curious about how they're made and start messing around with themselves to undo what you made?
God: I dunno, we'll make it overly complicated. Like billions and billions of variables.
Michael: Genius. ok so horny and complicated, what else?
God: Inherent superiority complex.
Michael: haha, earth is gonna suck.
DNA=Badly written programming code - Laser Link - 21st April 2006
Oh, and I should mention that legacy code is EVERYWHERE and will never completely be replaced. 40 year old code on 50 year old hardware (that has been replaced countless times) is running on some of the most vital systems in the world, and it will probably never be replaced. Even with the typical pessimistic outlook that runs rampant among most people our age, you would be shocked and a little frightened to learn about some of the government defense systems out there still...
And saying that "all the evidence" points to this is at best a huge exageration and at worst a blatant attempt at deception. DJ, I'm surprised to see something like that come from you.