A Black Falcon Wrote:Its puzzles like that that got me to call it a (simplified) adventure game... it's more than just 'get red key and open red door'.

Quote:-The enemy of this time in zombie of close ones only the person without also being the human

-As for natural shape of the enemy while keeping playing, it is understood

-You'll converse with the enemy but not in English. Spanish possibly?

-The game engine was modified once during the initial unveiling in 2002. After the last public showing of RE4 at E3 in May 2003, Mikami was unsatisfied with the directing the game was taking so the project was "rest' or started from scratch.

-Some of the primary game engine still exists from the previous attempts at RE4 but the location and setting has been totally redesigned.

-Because the reason of reset did not do "full model change". After all by the fact that Mikami enters into the director "full model change" became possible.

-Mikami has written the new story and scenario.

-Tricky translation..Looks like the scenario can change depending on what actions the player takes..

-Mikami hopes that a new level of 'Fear' will be created, anything unlike that was generated with REmake..

-Mikami believes RE4 will push the limits of what the GC can do.

-This part is tricky to translate but the setting has been written to pickup where RE3 left off after RE2 where Leon has now become a US Agent.

-Whether or not there will be a Resident Evil 5 has not been decided. However, RE4 marks the start of a whole new look and direction.

-Winter 2004 isn't that far off!




Part One of the translation between Famitsu and Shinji Mikami:

QUOTE
Serious consideration of the horror game genre-

Hamamura-Tsushin (Famitsu employee):
I just finished playing Bio-4.

Mikami-Shinji:
How was it?

Famitsu:
I was honestly suprised that the enemies were not zombies! It was very interesting. Very scary actually.

Mikami-Shinji:
Oh thats good...

Famitsu:
While I was playing I was thinking, the terror has changed, the tempo of the game has also changed. This time, the quaility of fear has changed has it not?

Mikami-Shinji:
That was what I naturally intented but, as for the degree of fear has been lowered somewhat.
From now on, the "type of horror" [flavor of horror] has been taken into serious consideration and...

Famitsu:
Yes, it seems...

Mikami-Shinji:
Concepts like survival horror games usually begin first with the type of horror, and after that the game style. I havent completly seperated the two, but the priority this time is reversed.

Famitsu:
The fun of playing has been placed ahead of the horror this time, right?

Mikami-Shinji:
Yes. This time I put the interesting aspects of "gameplay" ahead of everything else. The feeling of horror is gradually brought out by playing this way. So...um...Which is more important the noodles or soup? [japanese idiom?]

Famitsu:
"Hahahaha". Soup and noodles. Ah, I understand the sense of what you are saying.

Mikami-Shinji:
If we throw them both together, we cant really understand. Which is the flavour of the soup, which is the flavour of the noodles. After all is said and done, the you cant seperate them and have it taste good. The gameplay is the soup, while the horror is the noodles.

Famitsu:
true. true.

Mikami-Shinji:
After saying that, the noodles/(horror) in Bio-4 is "al dente"!!

Famitsu:
Hahahahaha!

Mikami-Shinji:
Funny how my conversation changed from gaming to Ramen, this is not a normal dialouge.

*Bio-4 producer Kobayashi*:
Mikami, please keep the topic in mind.

Mikami-Shinji:
Yes. Right, the boss is here!

Kobayashi:
Talk about whatever, its ok. I will edit/correct you later, so...

*Public Relations checks the manuscript!*

Mikami-Shinji:
You guys are the supervisors right? Cut out whatever im saying because you run the camp.
hahahaha

Famitsu:
Hahahaha

-The reason for the contents of the change-

Famitsu:
Gamesystems also are changing too, right? Lets compare it to the former games in the series. You have changed the whole model, huh?

Mikami-Shinji:
Yes

Famitsu:
Also, the fundamentals where changed from the beggining right?

Mikami-Shinji:
With Bio-4 we have recovered some freshness, because we changed so much. But, the important element of Biohazard (the series) has been carried along I think, dont you agree?

Famitsu:
What would you say is the word(s) that describes the core component?

Mikami-Shinji:
The core component is fear and destruction. This is a component of games from very long ago, tension and release/nervousness and calmness. Striking this balance... right?
This time, we took the essense of the Biohazard serious and broke it completely apart. Then reconstructed it.

Famitsu:
I see... Biohazard-4 plays like a completely different game, but the feeling Biohazard`s origins are still done. From playing the very first Biohazard I felt something near a new type of excitement [heart beating]

Mikami-Shinji:
Yes, because you felt that I am very happy. Now from the change of the base state of the game, I want you to enjoy playing the series again.





Part 2:

QUOTE
- The reason behind the change to WideScreen Mode-

Mikami:
In Bio-4 the camera changes to a WideScreen view when the action gets intense. Some of my inside staff complained about this. They even went so far as to call me "Stingy!"

Famitsu:
Why was that?

Mikami:
"The camera cuts off the gaming screen, you are being greedy" they said

Famitsu:
hahaha. Your inside staff had that reaction.

Mikami:
Yes they did. However, there was another affect to the view besides WideScreen cinematics. A normal TV has a view of 4:3, the action is centered in the middle. When the character takes up the middle of the screen the balance and view of the game is not so good. It makes you dizzy. When we tried it with the normal screen view we quickly realized this.

Famitsu:
So you say...

Mikami:
Yes. The placement of the player in Widescreen view to the side balances better this way.

Famitsu:
Oh, it doesnt make you so dizzy this way?

Mikami:
Less dizzy, a little bit but better than the normal screen option.

Famitsu:
I...yes. I get dizzy easily. But, when I played your game I did not have this feeling.

[sasimirobot note: maybe this explains the japanese distaste for FPS? My friend says this is common for Japanese dizzyness while driving, etc...]

- Survival Horror Games-

Mikami:
The tempo in Bio-4 is very fast. This is not the same system as the former Bios right?

Famitsu:
You mean the jerky movements and gunfire right (of the former titles)?

Mikami:
Yes. But now the tempo is moved up.

Famitsu:
I also have that feeling. The standard Bio tactics dont work. The enemies AI is better so they avoid shots more easily. I was thinking when lookin at it, the the change in speed of the game throws me off. But, after actually playing I got used to it really quickly. The controls are good, I have to say.

Mikami:
Maybe , (this control sceme) it is more enjoyable for Japanese than for foreigners, huh...This change of ways.

Famitsu:
I also not sure...( if they will like it)

Mikami:
The rules for finishing Japanese games has always been the same in the past... But as for the latest foreign games, this rule does not always apply.

Famitsu:
Yes. Yes. There are alot of "Free roaming" game products coming out, right?

Mikami:
Right. Gamers are requesting a change now.

Famitsu:
From now on, we have to exploit this rapidly new pioneering force.

Mikami:
That rule is also used in modern music. From the past to present , Japanese peoples rate of change has become a problem.

Famitsu:
Yes, you are right.

Mikami:
Foreign game creators are not trapped by our archaic gaming rules, and approach the user in a way that is more sensitive to their satisfaction.

Famitsu:
Understood. Understood. But in Japan after you have decided on the genre, game work begins immediately for most games.

Mikami:
That is a bad way to go about it. We didnt think about the genre deeply when we made Bio-1.

Famitsu:
ic...

Mikami:
But, if we didnt place that game in a specific genre "survival horror" right away it would not have sold. Wonder what would have happened if we didnt "fit" in...

Famitsu:
This is going in one ear and out the other. After all, Weekly Famitsu will have to call this genre "Action Adventure".

Mikami:
If gamers dont buy and then play it thent they wont understand.
Its essential that we have a genre they can fit it into , when we make new games because of this (unfortunately). "Sangokumusou" falls into the action game genre but its rythm is one of a RPG.

" The rhythm and tempo when playing, rather than a genre, are important for a game."

Famitsu:
Yes. Yes. that is right.

Mikami:
That PRG has an exhilarating feel, so playing for 3 hours or 5 hours doesnt make tired. It really is pleasurable, dont you agree? When Bio-1 was out, it wasnt an action game, more like a simulation. Now viewing it from the production side I think we need to match the tempo and rhythm of the game more closely to the users feelings.

Quote:-the pace of the game has been sped up alot. I get the feeling that the game has alot more suprise action scripted events and is more like House of the Dead III than Bio-1.
(Please dont think im suggesting the game is on rails, but the words "circuit/map/course" kept coming up. Im still working out the real meaning...)

For example, I dont think there are alot of *stand around and fire off 10 rounds into a zombie that is taking 4 minutes just to limp to you* . More like a few shots here, jump out the window, hop in the boat, etc... Rember the action choices in Bio-3 they gave you sometimes? but this time on the fly.

Not a single photo out of the dozen or so on the last 2 pages have the typical Bio stand around and shoot zombie look to them. All of them are actions of some sort.

Quote:I've already spent more than that on it, easily, and have two of them i think...

Quote:It would be physically impossible to do all of it in half an hour. You'll spend far more than that (FAR more) just sailing to all the places you need to go!

Quote:And the puzzles to get the maps aren't super easy or something... not super hard but not super easy.

Quote:Oh and you better hope you have enough money or you'll have a major hassle to get more...

Quote:and all the sailing... even if you CAN do it really quickly (which most people can't), you'll still spend a lot of time sailing... oh not horrible, I'm just saying that half an hour is a huge underexaggeration.

Quote:What puzzles? It's super easy!

Quote:That is false. Ever heard of warps before?

Quote:The FIRST time I played the game I beat that last triforce hunting part in a little over half an hour, and the second time I went through it I beat the part in half the time.

Conclusion: You suck. A lot.

Quote:There's a quick and easy way to max out on your rupee count in a matter in minutes, so that is not a problem. That's strike 3.

Quote:Like the one I solved yesterday where you have to use the fruit that makes a seagull come, then hit those five switches on the tall islands while avoiding the big birds trying to hit you, and then go down and use the right song to make the chest appear...

Quote:You can't warp to every screen you need to go to! And there are eight maps (hidden with puzzles), then money to Tingle, then back to the correct areas (once you identify which ones the maps are showing) and getting them... it takes time.

Quote:The correct conclusion is that you are exaggerating. Maybe it didn't take hours, but there is a minimum time it could take and you're under it.

Quote:Yes because of COURSE everyone knows the cheats to get lots of money! :rolleys: Or wants to use them, for that matter... seems pretty cheap to me... I don't know it but I wouldn't use it even if I did. As I said, cheap.

Quote:All told, the game can be completed in 15 to 20 hours, though considering all the extra heart pieces, treasure maps, and other little optional endeavors in the game, that number can increase fairly dramatically. The game's quest starts out in a very brisk manner, quickly moving you from dungeon to dungeon without delay. The game's final third, however, requires you to collect a series of items before you can gain entry to the game's final sequence. Collecting these items isn't difficult, but the focus on sailing, rupee collecting, and dredging up items from the bottom of the sea is pretty tedious. While this portion of the game has actually been shortened up a bit since the Japanese release, it still feels like it was put in the game merely to pad it out to an acceptable length. Thankfully, the game gets back on track after this portion is completed, and the game's final confrontation puts a nice new twist on the classic Zelda boss fight.

Quote:[sarcasm]Yeah that was tough.[/sarcasm]

Quote:You can warp to the main points on the map, which makes sailing from one place to another extremely fast. You get the maps, give them to Tingle, then get the triforce pieces. Easy as pie.

Quote:I must admit that I find it extremely amusing that you suck so badly that the mere thought of someone doing so much better than you is simply unimaginable. I'll take it as a compliment.

Quote:There are always quick-money shortcuts in Zelda titles, and they're usually really easy to figure out. There's not just one way of getting a quick rupee, either. I forgot exactly what I did, but I believe it involved finding valuable stuff and selling it to that boat guy. Or was is that rupee grass field that I found? Hmm...

And you wouldn't want to do that why, exactly? Because you LIKE doing it the hard way? You make no sense.

Quote:Gamespot's paragraph in question. And no it's not that reviewer.

Quote:Took me a while to realize there were 5... most of the time I can't just walk up to a puzzle and instantly see the solution, you know! It's not that simple!

As I said I just solved that puzzle and it was easy but I'd tried it before and for some reason hadn't gotten it... once I finally figured out you were supposed to use a seagull (that took a while), I tried it but I think I got hit and didn't notice 5 (I think I just hit the top one) and gave up for the time...

Quote:Even if you could solve all 8 puzzles for the maps instantly (which I can't; I didn't say most of them were super hard or anything but it takes at least a little time to figure out each one...) as Gamespot says the sailing takes quite a while! I won't call it boring (it's fun really), but it takes time warps or no. It's amazing that you are trying to deny that.

Quote:Yes yes we know you're the best game player ever and no one could possibly ever hope to match your phenominal skills but if you be realistic you'd realize that you are quite certainly greatly understating the amount of time it took. As I said just see Gamespot's review. They said that from the collecting maps part on is the last third of the game and didn't exactly say that it took half an hour. So it's not just me, as I knew it wasn't.

Quote:... okay using FAQs for games but not wanting to use a cheat code may not make sense, but I see something of a difference. At least with FAQs you still need to actually play the game yourself... I'd only cheat if I was REALLY stuck or really wanted to see the end of the game or something and even then I don't use them much. Like in Rush 2049... I could unlock everything by cheating, and it'd let me get things that would be extremely hard to get fairly, but it seems like the cheap way out...

Quote:They give you so many hints for that "puzzle"! You found the dungeon puzzles super easy but that one tough??

Quote:It's amazing how sucky you are and how said your argument is. "But gamespot said--!!". That's great, you found someone as sucky as you! Congrats!

There are no real puzzles involved with findind the last triforce pieces as most of them involve just killing a bunch of baddies and paying attention to super obvious hints. Sailing is super fast once you realize how to use the c-stick (it's pretty simple, you just use your right thumb and move it) in order to use the baton.

Quote:Right, because there are TONS of cheats in Zelda games. It's not a cheat! It's a quick and easy way to make money if you have the intelligence and luck to figure it out! Find a place with tons of bad guys, kill them, hit the gems when they turn a certain color, collect rupees, repeat. Find a big field of grass, collect tons of blue rupees, walk inside a house, go back outside and repeat. It's not cheating. Using FAQ's is cheating. This is not.

Quote:Obviously the reviewer is as sucky at games as you are since he complained about having to find rupees, which was never a problem for me.

Quote:I'm not the best Zelda player in the world, believe me. I usually take a while with puzzles, and the 2D bosses are usually pretty damn tough for me. However, I do tend to play through games very quickly. Call it a lack of patience or whatever, but I can usually find a quick way out of something. I timed how long it took for me to get those last triforce pieces because before the game came out I read all of those complaints of how long it takes and knew that it would come up in a future argument. It took me barely over half an hour to get all of them! It was a minor annoyance but not nearly as painful as you big cry babies say it was.

Quote:Hints? Where? I don't remember any hints for that puzzle!

Quote:Huh? I know that you sail in a direction, then cast the spell to change wind direction and then sail in that one, then do the warp if you're going somewhere near a teleporter, etc... it takes time.

Quote:Oh I was just playing. There are a bunch of mini-dungeons and those take time. Maybe you could get through three of them in half an hour but no matter how you try to spin it this thing takes hours. It's not the hardest thing ever but it is impossible to deny that it takes hours. Okay it could be done faster than I am doing it but I can easily see that there is a minimum time you could do this in, and your "half hour" is so absurdly far under that that it's ridiculous.

Quote:The color of those gems matters?

Quote:And FAQs are not cheating. Help isn't cheating. Cheating is getting past something without actually doing that... okay what you are talking about there isn't cheating. It's exploiting. And I wouldn't do that either.
When you exploit the game like you clearly did I'm sure it wasn't.

Quote:Sorry but I am sure that it is impossible to do everything involved in getting the pieces in half an hour even if you knew exactly what to do (from setting out to get the first map until you have all eight shards with you -- all of that time, not just part of it!) and had enough money to buy all the shards at once. Completely impossible. And for your first try when you say that 'puzzles take you a while'? It's ludicrous to say that!

Quote:I forgot exactly, but I remember it being very obvious.

Quote:Different colors give different things. But I suppose knowing that would be exploitative, right??

Quote:It's an absolute FACT that I finished it in a little over half an hour. Here, I'll record myself doing it all over again and if you give me money for shipping and a blank tape I'll send it to you. Seriously, I'll do it!

Quote:You = sucking does not = me sucking. A guy just beat Super Mario Bros. in five minutes. I guess you'd call that impossible too, right? Your poor gaming skills make you believe that everyone is that bad and you cannot even fathom something better than you. I find that very, very pathetic.

Quote:Exploiting?? What an idiot thing to say! It's bad that I found an easy way to make money in WW? I guess it's bad that I made tons of cash in Shenmue II by gambling and didn't have to work for hours like other people did, right? It's a game, you're supposed to find different ways to do things. Finding a bug is a different matter. This is not a bug.

I guess it's also really bad to get lots of bottles in OoT and fill them up with fairies in a fairy fountain, right? Dork.

Quote:Gamers who played the Japanese version of the title, though, will be happy to learn that Nintendo has for the most part improved the US incarnation by eliminating some of the extra tediousness surrounding the collection of some Triforce pieces in the water. It can still be frustrating, gathering all sorts of Triforce maps in order to endlessly search out pieces of the artifact, but at least it's now possible to see where they are directly on a map. (In the Japanese version, one such quest had you find a map, that led to a map, that led to a map, that led to a Triforce map. That one thankfully got the axe.) The sheer amount of time saved by this addition is practically immeasurable, so thanks, Nintendo.

Quote:There were no hints. You just had to figure it out.

Quote:No, that's just a game feature... I didn't know there was a difference based on what color it is...

Quote:It's not a fact because it's impossible.

Quote:And please do tape it. I'd love to see you play it again and see that you are completely wrong.

Quote:I was just playing it and do you remember the dungeon in the start island(Outset?)? Yeah, the one where you need to fight through 30 rooms to get the map piece. Even at top speed that'll eat up almost half of that 30 minuites... I went through it as quickly as I could and made good time but there are 30 stages and it takes time no matter how good you are. Maybe you could do it in 10 minuites but that'd be pretty fast. if you could manage to even just beat all of those other mini-dungeons in the other 15 I'd be pretty impressed... oh they aren't super long but there are many of them...

Quote:Face it, it takes a couple of hours at least. More if it's your first try because you won't know the puzzles. Go actually play the game and you'll see what I mean.

Quote:Now, the game IS fun. The main reason I quit really wasn't because I couldn't find any maps but because the ones I was trying to get were annoying me... see I never thought of in your resort house using the grappling hook on the celing beam thing. I looked around that island so many times for where that triforce map was... then I went to a FAQ. I didn't even know that any of your items worked in the house... that's the kind of puzzle that's easy if you get it but if not it could take forever... Once I actually got down the fireplace it was simple enough though.

Oh, or how about the puzzle I'm at now? It's the one to get the Ghost Ship Map, with those pots that teleport you... after spending like ten or fifteen minuites on it I quit in annoyance. Stupid stupid puzzle... and unless you get a FAQ for a map or something unless you're lucky it could take a long time to complete.

Quote:I am sure that it is not physically possible to do everything needed for all 8 shards in half an hour. That is unless you run it in an emulator at like 600x or something... but for a real human being, completely impossible regardless of skill level. Say something like 'a couple of hours' and you'd be on track for a quick runthrough of the part of the game if you've done it before and know what to do... I know that Zelda games become far easier and quicker once you've beaten them and know what to do. But still all the transit time and the amount of time you spend fighting enemies (unless you know a magic way to instantly kill them) and you're looking at a couple of hours most likely.

You just forgot how long this takes and don't want to look stupid by giving in but I am actually PLAYING this part of the game right now and know that it is impossible to do in your supposed time.

Quote:In Mario 3 it would be possible to win in that like 15 minuites or something if you could go at full speed through the entire game. Even if you did that in this it'd take far, far over half an hour.

Quote:No, it's not a bug, but it's a cheap way to get money when you know they don't mean for you to just load up on money that easily... compared to faries where if you get the bottles of course they expect you to use them...

Quote:Oh here's the IGN review's paragraph about collecting the Triforce...

Quote:That's a great, classic Zelda-style puzzle! And it's so easy!

Quote:You're so stupid! Getting tons of rupees from grass is an important part of the game and it's been a staple of the series from the very beginning! Just because you couldn't figure out something as simple as that doesn't make it "cheating".

Quote:Someone beat Mario 1 in 5 minutes.

Quote:That long dungeon takes ten minutes tops to beat. If you're slow. The other "dungeons" take five minutes to beat. And I can't believe you consider those puzzles. You really do suck!

Quote:Seriously ABF, this makes you look like an more of a dumbass than you already are (if that's possible). You're just bad at certain games, and denying that you're simply bad at the game and that certain others are much better than you isn't helping matters.

Quote:There were very obvious hints. You're just a tad bit on the dense side.

Quote:Well some are only puzzles in a loose sense (ie "solve" something by killing baddies and you progress), but there are some puzzles... like the islands and the bird, or the switch to get in the basement, or the maze that is in said cellar under your house... okay it was a simple maze but it WAS a maze. Oh and 15 or so minuites for that 30-stage big dungeon is hardly slow. I kept going after that but had to give up at 40 because I'd used both of my faries and only had 2 1/2 hearts left... I wanted to finish but knew I wouldn't get anywhere close, not with that much health left.

Quote:After spending like 10 minuites constantly getting sent back to the start and just finding one chest with money it was too annoying and I quit. Easy it is not unless as I said you are lucky or something...

Quote:Getting rupees from grass takes a long time to make much because you get 1 at a time and most grass gives you none... unless you just farm some field that has lots of rupees that seems a bit cheap and would get very boring very fast.

Quote:By memonizing the whole game? Well might be possible.

Quote:Well some are only puzzles in a loose sense (ie "solve" something by killing baddies and you progress), but there are some puzzles... like the islands and the bird, or the switch to get in the basement, or the maze that is in said cellar under your house... okay it was a simple maze but it WAS a maze. Oh and 15 or so minuites for that 30-stage big dungeon is hardly slow. I kept going after that but had to give up at 40 because I'd used both of my faries and only had 2 1/2 hearts left... I wanted to finish but knew I wouldn't get anywhere close, not with that much health left.

Quote:And you've already proven your "half hour" false you know. Nice to see you can see reason... even when you can't admit it in as many words... I mean, you in other responses here insult me for saying that it's impossible to to in half an hour but here you say that that one takes 10 minuites (reasonable if you move fast) and those other 5 or 6 mini dungeons (there isn't one for a couple of them but the ghost ship has two if you include the maze) take 5 minuites (possible for some, not for others; for most it really depends on how fast you can fight, but for others... like the maze under the house if you memorize the quickest route it could be fast. Same for the pots -- if you've done it before you know the route and can do it quickly. But for both, and especially for that one, the first time through "5 minuites" is unlikely. Oh they aren't exactly epic dungeons, but it takes a bit more than that. I think you just forget how long it takes and just think' that didnt' take long'. Which it didn't, of course, but 5 minuites? I don't know. Only if you can dispatch those monsters quick and catch on on how to get through mazes in record time...

Quote:Laughable comment given that you just admitted that half an hour is not a possible number to even just beat the dungeons where you get the maps. That is of course not counting the sailing between said dungeons (and not all are on warps so you must spend some time sailing!) and then the sailing to the fishing spots to dig up some triforce pieces... face it, you're count is well off.

And I'm not bad at Zelda games. Including this one. You may be better than me but that does not mean I am bad. You're just basing your statements on your faulty memory and your standard need to use insults when reasoned arguements can't be thought of fast enough.

Quote:I don't recall any hints, obvious or not. Just an island where you can use the grappling hook to get on the roof of the cave. No "hints".

Quote:I'm really not sure how doing some mundane task to gain what you need is cheap in any way, boring as it may get (like the pot trick in LTTP). However, I suppose when you are used to PC style RPGs where there is no infinite well of XP OR money, one can see any sort of infinite source of pretty much anything done over and over as cheap.

Quote:You must be missing one of your thumbs. That wasn't hard at all. It forced me to use one fairy, but I made it out with most of my health and two other fairies (plus the Grandma's Soup that I got at the beginning and never ended up using).

Quote:Lemme just ask one thing. In every Zelda game before this (excepting MAYBE the oracle games, which I haven't yet mastered), you can always go back from the very end of the game and collect EVERY SINGLE item, chest, or anything else that's recorded by the save file in the whole game. The only exception to this rule is OOT with one of the max item holding upgrades for the deku sticks I think, if you collect the ocarina of time before you show the mask of truth to the mask judging plants, however that's an obvious glitch so it doesn't really count. So, is Wind Waker the same way, or are there some items and events you can't get to after certain points?

Quote:Under five minutes each, and that includes the mazes. It is most certainly possible to get all of them in roughly half an hour, and if you send me the money for the tape I'll prove it to you.

Quote:They give you hints as soon as you get that food. You're just dense.

Quote:Thank you! Okay it's fine that ABF is no good at the game, but it's very annoying when he finds it impossible to believe when someone is better than he is.

Quote:

Quote:I'm really not sure how doing some mundane task to gain what you need is cheap in any way, boring as it may get (like the pot trick in LTTP). However, I suppose when you are used to PC style RPGs where there is no infinite well of XP OR money, one can see any sort of infinite source of pretty much anything done over and over as cheap.

Exactly! I have no idea how that weirdo can call it "cheating".

Quote:Hahaha, there's an actual pattern that you have to follow. You have to pay attention to your surroundings. It's all about memory.

Quote:Oh thanks for the help...

Quote:5x6=30. +10 for the deep dungeon and you've got 40. Now add an hour of sailing (being very, very generous -- it should be quite a bit higher), which would mean going at top speed, and assuming you could also get all 8 triforce shards almost instantly, and you've got what i said a good player could do it in -- a couple of hours. You are wrong unless you change the definition of the question. Which you probably will do because you cannot bear being wrong.

Quote:As I said I may not be quite as good as you and it may take me a bit longer than average (hours count), but that does not make me bad at the game. I KNOW I am right on this and unless you have some dramatically different interpretation of how you do this your "half hour" is impossible. Hour and a half? Maybe. It'd be close, but if you go fast it's feasible, like that 5 minuite game of Mario... but half an hour? You cannot physically move fast enough to do all that stuff in anywhere close to such a small amount of time. And remember there's more to it than just finishing those mini-dungeons...

Quote:Umm you DO know that he's talking about that deep dungeon on Outset, which you hadn't really talked about much so that reaction is kind of silly, right? You certainly haven't said if you beat all 50 levels on your first try or how many faries it took you so saying this is just silly, unless you forgot what he was talking about.

Quote:As for me, the reason I lost so much health... part of it was that it just wears on you with so many baddies, but the biggest chunks came from several stages where I forgot how to fight some kinds of enemies because I hadn't played in too long. That obviously would go a lot faster on a repeat play and would be easier so I bet on a second try I'd finish the dungeon...
Oh, and I only have two bottles. If I did have a third and some soup I well might have made it...

Quote: Again an innapropriate response. My response to that same comment of DJ's would be 'yeah that could be one reason that I would consider that cheating, I'm not sure'... Thinking back to Quest for Glory. That's a Adventure-RPG I've had for a very long time. It has stats that you improve with practice as long as you had any points in them in the beginning of the game. Try to climb that tree fifty times and you're better at Climbing. I remember for a few parts I did have to repeat tasks many times, but on the whole I would just play... I didn't for instance walk around Sneaking to increase that stat, or spend hours trying to throw rocks at something up a tree... just seems a waste of time... Anyway, so far I've managed to have enough money by just playing through the dungeons (you get a LOT in that one on the start island!) and pulling up chests every time I see a beacon to hoist from the sea... I don't search for those spots, but if I see one I'll get the item.

Quote:Oh thanks for the help...

Quote:The long dungeon I can do in 8, the others take 3, and the rest including sailing takes 10 minutes. 36 minutes. You suck.

Quote:There are not 50 levels! I never had to use a fairy there.

Quote:If the developers put it in the game as a way to make a quick rupee, then it's not cheating by any defintion of the word.

Quote:Hey I don't have magical anti-suck juice....

Quote:You're still underestimating (especially how long all that sailing will take; remember that a few are not on warp squares and sailing there and back will take up a good block of time), but at least you're starting to think a bit more now. Kinda.

Quote:The spots on the sea chart where the triforce maps are located don't have to coincide with the warp destinations to get to the island. You could just warp to a destination block nearby the island and sail from there. So sailing from one island to another shouldn't take any more than 2 minutes at one time. Had you realized that? The reason I ask is because it sounds like you aren't using the warp song if it doesn't take you directly to an island. If I remember correctly (although it's been almost a year), the sailing in itself shouldn't take a whole hour.