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I'd gloat like OB1 did, but it wouldn't be nice... oh wait... - Printable Version +- Tendo City (https://www.tendocity.net) +-- Forum: Tendo City: Metropolitan District (https://www.tendocity.net/forumdisplay.php?fid=4) +--- Forum: Tendo City (https://www.tendocity.net/forumdisplay.php?fid=42) +--- Thread: I'd gloat like OB1 did, but it wouldn't be nice... oh wait... (/showthread.php?tid=1973) Pages:
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I'd gloat like OB1 did, but it wouldn't be nice... oh wait... - A Black Falcon - 9th June 2004 http://money.cnn.com/2004/06/09/commentary/game_over/column_gaming/index.htm Here's another article OB1 will dismiss out of hand based on his bizarre love for Sony... I'll post it for the click-impaired. Some very harsh words from the head of Infogrames ("Atari") for the PSP... Quote:PlayStation Portable for $500? I'd gloat like OB1 did, but it wouldn't be nice... oh wait... - OB1 - 10th June 2004 Quote:Riiight, we know nothing about the battery life of games. Nope. Yet we still don't know what battery life games will get. I wonder why that is... hmm, perhaps it could be because we don't know how well developers will use the system RAM? Gee wiz, I think that's it! Quote:Here's another article OB1 will dismiss out of hand based on his bizarre love for Sony... Yes, because I don't have a blind, biased hatred towards Sony like you do and take a very unbiased stance when it comes to videogames, I have a "bizarre love" for Sony. If that's what you call love then I feel sorry for your future significant other. Quote:I'll post it for the click-impaired. Some very harsh words from the head of Infogrames ("Atari") for the PSP... I find it very, very sad that your only ammunition in this debate is conjecture and quotes from Atari of all people. This is a new low for you, ABF. I'd gloat like OB1 did, but it wouldn't be nice... oh wait... - UltraMarioMan - 10th June 2004 Quote:Developers on the N64 had to work around the system's low amount of RAMActually N64 had more ram then the PSX from the start. Its limitation was the texture cache. I'd gloat like OB1 did, but it wouldn't be nice... oh wait... - OB1 - 10th June 2004 Yes but N64 developers had to utilize the RAM in more ways than PSX developers did. I'd gloat like OB1 did, but it wouldn't be nice... oh wait... - UltraMarioMan - 10th June 2004 Yes for better graphics. I'd gloat like OB1 did, but it wouldn't be nice... oh wait... - Dark Jaguar - 10th June 2004 Ah yes I remember the whole RAM thing. Thanks to Sony listing the system specs right on the box with the PS1, I found out the system had a grand total of 2 MB for RAM, and 1 MB of special video RAM. What with carts having a fast load time anyway, and the PS1 having a 2x speed CD-ROM, they REALLY had to learn how to use that RAM effectively, and did they ever, eventually. While lots of games suffered from horrible load times, some such as Castlevania: Symphony of the Night, managed to load what would normally be massive amounts of images into that small area with no loading, the system just being busy playing back the red book audio tracks. Even when the system did have to load new images, it only took a small amount of time. MGS and the later FF games also managed to really optimize the whole thing. Amazing how well they managed to use that piddly amount of RAM really... I'd gloat like OB1 did, but it wouldn't be nice... oh wait... - OB1 - 10th June 2004 Developers always need a good challenge to prove how good they are. You need limitations and challenges in order to become better. For example, the game that I'm making right now (not that I consider myself a developer, just a garage-level fooler-arounder) has an enormous amount of drawbacks that we have to find ways to work around, and in a few cases we came up with some great ideas that probably wouldn't have come up if it weren't for the limitations of the engine. Creating a game entirely from scratch is a tough thing to do, and sometimes I just hate java. Another example is the movie Jaws, where originally Spielberg wanted you to be able to see more of the shark, but because they couldn't get the effect right you saw very little of it in the movie which actually added to the suspense. I forgot where I was going with this, but you get my point. I'd gloat like OB1 did, but it wouldn't be nice... oh wait... - A Black Falcon - 10th June 2004 Quote:I find it very, very sad that your only ammunition in this debate is conjecture and quotes from Atari of all people. This is a new low for you, ABF. Exactly the kind of response I expected. You are in serious denial here... I sunk to a new low by posting an article that gave a lengthy list of the problems with the PSP as we know it now? Quote:Yes, because I don't have a blind, biased hatred towards Sony like you do and take a very unbiased stance when it comes to videogames, I have a "bizarre love" for Sony. If that's what you call love then I feel sorry for your future significant other. You are not acting unbiased here. You're strongly defending Sony in places that even the Sony people aren't going. I just recognize problems as problems. You seem to want to just ignore such things. "It'll be awesome and the critics are all morons" isn't an unbiased perspective on the issue. Quote:Yet we still don't know what battery life games will get. I wonder why that is... hmm, perhaps it could be because we don't know how well developers will use the system RAM? Gee wiz, I think that's it! If it would make THAT much of a difference they'd probably be hinting that games could be a lot higher... and mentioning numbers for that as well. They aren't. Doesn't that mean anything? As for RAM, Rare made a mistake not adding a (optional, fine) mode in B-T and Conker to support the expansion pack to increase the framerate. I'd gloat like OB1 did, but it wouldn't be nice... oh wait... - OB1 - 10th June 2004 Quote:Exactly the kind of response I expected. You are in serious denial here... I sunk to a new low by posting an article that gave a lengthy list of the problems with the PSP as we know it now? "lengthly list of problems"?? Please, list all of the factual problems from that article. Seriously, just try. Quote:You are not acting unbiased here. You're strongly defending Sony in places that even the Sony people aren't going. I just recognize problems as problems. You seem to want to just ignore such things. "It'll be awesome and the critics are all morons" isn't an unbiased perspective on the issue. I am taking the most unbiased view on this subject out of anyone here, while you remind me of the glory days of the Gaystation and Nintendo Sucks sites. I haven't seen this sort of blind bias in a long time. This is classic fanboy syndrome here, all of the symptoms are the same. You only own Nintendo consoles, so competition is a threat to you. Acknowledging realistic strengths and weaknesses of those competing consoles would make you realize that you are missing out on a lot, and simply being an ignorant fanboy and thinking that what you cannot have is terrible is a lot easier to take. I know exactly how it is, I've been there. The Gameboy is your favorite system, and the PSP poses a huge threat to it. So rather than looking at the situation with no biases (like I am doing; calling me a Sony fanboy shows just how sad your argument has become), you grasp for straws and blow even the most baseless points out of proportion in order to help make yourself feel better, to lessen the threat of the PSP. It's extremely sad to see. Quote:If it would make THAT much of a difference they'd probably be hinting that games could be a lot higher... and mentioning numbers for that as well. They aren't. Doesn't that mean anything? So... the lack of information to you automatically means something negative. To you zero equals negative one, while to me it equals a question mark since it could go either way. That, my blind friend, is the main difference between us two. I'd gloat like OB1 did, but it wouldn't be nice... oh wait... - A Black Falcon - 10th June 2004 Quote:I am taking the most unbiased view on this subject out of anyone here, while you remind me of the glory days of the Gaystation and Nintendo Sucks sites. I haven't seen this sort of blind bias in a long time. This is classic fanboy syndrome here, all of the symptoms are the same. You only own Nintendo consoles, so competition is a threat to you. Acknowledging realistic strengths and weaknesses of those competing consoles would make you realize that you are missing out on a lot, and simply being an ignorant fanboy and thinking that what you cannot have is terrible is a lot easier to take. I know exactly h[QUOTE]ow it is, I've been there. The Gameboy is your favorite system, and the PSP poses a huge threat to it. So rather than looking at the situation with no biases (like I am doing; calling me a Sony fanboy shows just how sad your argument has become), you grasp for straws and blow even the most baseless points out of proportion in order to help make yourself feel better, to lessen the threat of the PSP. It's extremely sad to see. Most unbiased. You seriously think that. Pathetic. You are so obviously partizan towards Sony on this that it's ridiculous... and you try to call your position "nonpartizan"??? Seriously, do you see anyone else here defending Sony's battery life? Have I seen any articles on major gaming websites that say that they are satisfied with what Sony is saying about the battery life? Have I even seen final numbers for this, for the price, etc... I think you get my point. Your position, that we can't even begin to speculate because we know nothing, is idiotic. You just don't want to talk about it because the things we know are generally negative for Sony. Oh, and it's not like I'm talking about Nintendo here. I'm just talking about Sony. Not the PSP vs the DS, or the PSP vs the GBA... and you're also wrong if you think I have some kind of irrational hatred for Sony. Sure I like Nintendo a lot more but that isn't the point here, what we know about the PSP is the point... and it's not a picture like you are trying to portray it as. Oh yeah and the line about me only owning Nintendo consoles is incredibly stupid. Or have you forgotten that I like PC games? :) Sure, it's not a "console", but it's a system which I play games on, and a whole lot of them, so it makes a mockery of that whole line of arguement of yours. On that same line, if I was to rate platforms that I have it'd probably go like this. PC > N64 > Gamecube. it's tough to directly compare those to the GB/GBC/GBA though... but I'd probably say that the GB is between the N64 and Cube. I don't know... tough to decide... Calling you a Sony fanboy... sure on other issues you don't act that way but I was talking about this one in specific, not anything else. And here you sure seem to really, really want the PSP to not only win but roll over the competition, and for it to have super-great stats. This thing with you and battery life is a perfect example of that you know... Oh, on that note, you have a great talent for retreating on an issue without acting like you conceeded an inch. Recall that in E3 you posted that "hahaha you idiots it'll get 10 hours in games just like the GBA (, and that's awesome)" post? THAT is the post of somone being BALANCED??? Are you crazy? Now you're saying it'll get 6 hours, yet are acting just as arguementative and viscious in your attacks as ever. You retreat while not admitting it... you cut your estimate almost in half while not admitting even the slightest hint that I (or all the website articles I have seen about the issue) were right... amazing... If I take what you say at face value, it is impossible to estimate battery life. No other electronic device's battery life has even the slightest shred of importance because Sony, the super-great tech developers they are, have used all new technology in the PSP that makes any comparisons in battery life competely irrelevant. All articles discussing battery life that talk about how, given what it does, what the battery life will likely be are also completely irrelevant because those people have absolutely not idea what they are talking about... after all no other technology has any relation whatsoever with the PSP so comparing various things won't get you anywhere at all. We have to wait for Sony's official announcement. And like with the price, and the release date, and the connectivity strategy, and the MP3 player, and the movie player, and how many models of PSP there will be, etc... Sony's recitence in giving out all the details on these things means absolutely nothing. It isn't a sign that they are reluctant to say anything because they know the news won't be well recieved, it's an indication of only that they haven't said anything and nothing more. No conclusions can POSSIBLY be drawn from anything. Now, you might say 'but Nintendo hasn't said much about some of those things either!' and you'd be right. Nintendo's reluctance to say things annoys us all all the time... but they DID give a battery life estimate, for one thing. And they aren't trying to make it a unified media device, just a game player with some other (relatively minor) functions. I'm not asking for all the final details. Since the PSP probably won't be out until next year, that's unrealistic. But ANYTHING would be very nice and the lack of them, and the way that Sony dances around the issues so many times (and then says bizarre things like how no one actually plays portable systems outside of their house anyway, a very strong indication of what the battery life is going to be...) makes me, and a very large number of other people, very suspicious. Your attitude towards that suspicion is both very stupid and exactly what I'd expect from you once you latch onto a position. On that note I bet that if we hadn't been arguing about this before and the issue just came up now, you'd be a lot closer to my perspective here... but you've been locked into "I love Sony" mode on the PSP and can't even begin to back down of course. I'd gloat like OB1 did, but it wouldn't be nice... oh wait... - Dark Jaguar - 10th June 2004 Not sure what's going on here, but I can say that SOME of us have enough of an understanding of electronics to have at least an IDEA of how long the battery life must be. I'd gloat like OB1 did, but it wouldn't be nice... oh wait... - A Black Falcon - 10th June 2004 Not according to OB1. I'd gloat like OB1 did, but it wouldn't be nice... oh wait... - Dark Jaguar - 10th June 2004 Well that's fine. Anyway, I gotta say the whole battery life thing is a bit of an issue for me. Car adapters could solve it sure, but that goes for the Game Gear as well, and that apparently wasn't enough. I just like having something that will last an entire trip, or at least most of it, both inside and outside the vehicle. Eh, my stance is still as it was, I'll be waiting until I find out what exclusives it has before I'm interested, but the battery life sure seems very low. Also, if it's super expensive (and honestly squishing that quality screen, a PS2, and a battery into that kind of space has GOT to raise the costs to something amazing, it's just the reality of it), then that's another problem. I mean, Sony has taken losses before, but if they sold it for $300 out of the gate, that's still likely an over $100 loss on their part, LIKELY anyway. They may have found some cheaper methods of construction, but I'm still willing to bet it'll be sold for $300 at launch and still be a loss for Sony per system sale. Eh, yeah it'll likely be a while before systems can actually be released as portables from the start... I'd gloat like OB1 did, but it wouldn't be nice... oh wait... - A Black Falcon - 10th June 2004 I think that's what he is saying, anyway... it's kind of hard to tell given how much he mixes insults in with his posts and which parts are just him being mad and which parts are actually points... And yes, I'd bet on $300 as a midrange figure. Or maybe $250 if they want more market share and don't mind losing money. But if they don't want to lose money, it'll almost certainly be more... $350? $400? Who knows how much the thing actually costs to make... I'd gloat like OB1 did, but it wouldn't be nice... oh wait... - OB1 - 11th June 2004 Oh no, you're totally right. I'm an absolute Sony fanboy, and especially a PSP fanboy. So much so in fact, that Nintendo is my favorite developer, I'm looking forward to the DS more than the PSP, and I thought the DS stole E3. Yup, true signs of a biased fanboy! ![]() Admit it Brian, you're just an immature, biased Nintendo fanboy who hates all competition. The PC is not competiting with the GC. That has never counted. You like PC games, and you like Nintendo system games. That is all. And why is that? BECAUSE YOU'RE A BIASED FANBOY!! Honestly, the more you deny this the more of a compete retard you make yourself look like. Calling me a Sony fanboy when I like Nintendo a hell of a lot more than you do, soley because I don't like just them and try my best to have an unbiased opinion on the industry as a whole shows how incredibly inane and futile your pathetic argument is. It's like calling me anti-Star Wars because I also love Star Trek. Don't make everyone laugh. And as for the battery issue, none of us know if games will use up two or eight hours of battery life. It's not an issue of knowing anything about electronics, it's an issue of knowing how developers will make their games. And I'm sorry to burst your idiotic bubble, but you have no fucking clue what that answer is. I'd gloat like OB1 did, but it wouldn't be nice... oh wait... - UltraMarioMan - 11th June 2004 *Looks at the "Tendo City: All Your E3 Are Belong to Nintendo!" forum title* OH NO THERE ARE NINTENDO FANBOYS HERE!!! :P I'd gloat like OB1 did, but it wouldn't be nice... oh wait... - OB1 - 11th June 2004 Fanboys, plenty. Biased Nintendo fanboys? Only a few. I'd gloat like OB1 did, but it wouldn't be nice... oh wait... - A Black Falcon - 11th June 2004 Quote:Oh no, you're totally right. I'm an absolute Sony fanboy, and especially a PSP fanboy. So much so in fact, that Nintendo is my favorite developer, I'm looking forward to the DS more than the PSP, and I thought the DS stole E3. Yup, true signs of a biased fanboy! I'll just respond by quoting my post. You didn't actually respond to my point. Quote:Calling you a Sony fanboy... sure on other issues you don't act that way but I was talking about this one in specific, not anything else. And here you sure seem to really, really want the PSP to not only win but roll over the competition, and for it to have super-great stats. This thing with you and battery life is a perfect example of that you know... Quote:Admit it Brian, you're just an immature, biased Nintendo fanboy who hates all competition. The PC is not competiting with the GC. That has never counted. You like PC games, and you like Nintendo system games. That is all. And why is that? BECAUSE YOU'RE A BIASED FANBOY!! Honestly, the more you deny this the more of a compete retard you make yourself look like. Calling me a Sony fanboy when I like Nintendo a hell of a lot more than you do, soley because I don't like just them and try my best to have an unbiased opinion on the industry as a whole shows how incredibly inane and futile your pathetic argument is. It's like calling me anti-Star Wars because I also love Star Trek. Don't make everyone laugh. You are incredibly, incredibly stupid if you believe half of what you say here. But it's all stuff that I think I've refuted a billion times before so trying again would just be pointless. I mean, you're taking this and turning it into something totally absurd. Um, if I take this statement a very small step forward, IGN PSP are Nintendo fanboys too because they wrote several articles critisizing Sony on the battery life issue. Same for Gamespy, and Gamespot, and Atari. They're all huge Nintendo fanboys because they pointed out things they saw as legitimate issues in Sony's gameplan. Seriously, could a point possibly be any worse? You have absolutely nothing going for you in this arguement so you make something up. And it's totally absurd. How can you take a post that gives very good reasons to be quite suspicious/cautious about Sony, backed up with plenty of sources, and turn it into just me hating Sony? It's so ridiculous that I don't know how you come up with this stuff... I play games. On a bunch of systems. Yes, three of the four are Nintendo. So? Many of those games are third party. I've used PS2s and X-Boxes before... sure, I like Nintendo more and Sony less, but you're taking this way farther than is possible based on facts, and on an issue where that is barely a factor on the main point. The only place where I can see where my personal opinion of Sony would come in here is anything to do with quality. Of the actual system, that is -- how well it'll work. Other than that? It's not ME who wrote the articles critisizing Sony for it's recitence in divulging information. It's not ME who wrote how because of the low profit margins on the PSP the thing will have to have a huge percentage of porting or third parties would have no hope of making money (since portable games sell for less and make less but now could cost as much as major-console ones). Etc. I hope you get the idea. I'd post articles on the major sites that are more positive towards Sony on these issues as well if I'd seen them, but I haven't seen any... Oh yeah and all systems that play games compete. They compete for my time and my money. They don't compete? Wha? Quote:And as for the battery issue, none of us know if games will use up two or eight hours of battery life. It's not an issue of knowing anything about electronics, it's an issue of knowing how developers will make their games. And I'm sorry to burst your idiotic bubble, but you have no fucking clue what that answer is. The only person who needs to admit something here is you. And what you have to admit is that there are good reasons right now to critisize the PSP. You're trying to push them all under the rug for some indecipherable reason (read: just to annoy me), but everyone ELSE recognizes potential problems as problems and recognizes that Sony aren't gods. They work on known technology like everyone else. So we can make well educated guesses at the PSP battery life. It's incredibly stupid of you to just totally ignore all these articles... not just my opinion, but articles by people who know this issue much better than I do. Including SONY ITSSELF! I don't know how you keep ignoring all this and pretending than none of it is a problem, but the self delusion will have to end sometime. I'd just rather it be sooner as opposed to later. Your whole arguement at this point is that by using the disc less games will be able to dramatically improve battery life. Like, twice, three times dramatically. Like, 2 1/2 hours to 8 hours? That just does not make any logical sense to me. Post one article that says that reducing battery life a bit (like it'd do if you have condensed loading instead of more spread out or streaming loading) could improve battery life that much and I'll listen, but until then I'll trust what I have actually read and think that that sounds pretty ridiculous. Your "theory" is called wishful thinking, and it's a big part of why I said that on this issue you're acting like a Sony fanboy. This is the real world here, not fantasy-land. Sony isn't being incredibly vague about battery life just for fun, not with the amount of criticizm they've gotten for not saying much. They're doing it because they don't want to admit the exact truth to the public. I'd gloat like OB1 did, but it wouldn't be nice... oh wait... - Private Hudson - 11th June 2004 Or they're unsure of the exact truth, as to figure out the exact truth you need to develop for the console, and find every little strength and weakness in the machine to find out the exact truth. I'd gloat like OB1 did, but it wouldn't be nice... oh wait... - Lord Shockwave - 19th June 2004 Just as a random thought, what the fuck are you going to design a portable for if you have to be plugged into the wall all of the time? Now, I DO play games on the go, and have been known to use my GBASP quite often, so when I hear news like this, it's just fucking stupid. ![]() |