5th June 2003, 2:26 PM
As hazardous as this shit is, does anyone REALLY have the right to tell them they can't do it to themselves? It's close to the suicide argument in that respect.
5th June 2003, 2:26 PM
5th June 2003, 2:43 PM
5th June 2003, 11:11 PM
Quote:a very sad sight indeed.
http://www.northernalliance.ca/gas_...es/image002.jpg
This kids sniffs gasoline 24/7 , a hole gang of them are addicted to it even despite goverment attempts to detox them.
All of them suffer from brain damage from breathing powerful chemicals on a daily basis.
Sure we could say its their right to poison themselves , but that would be careless of us ,atleast out of 50 kids , 2 were rehebilitated.
What idiots. And to think, this might not have happened if weed were accessible to these children!
Smoking weed certainly isn't as destructive as inhaling fumes. This is in jest, though, as I don't condone children using any potentially addictive and destructive substances. It should be up to the parents to stop this, though, not the government. I don't think my freedom to be responsible for my own body should be taken away so the parents of children have to do less work.6th June 2003, 8:23 AM
Quote:Originally posted by Sacred Jellybean
What idiots. And to think, this might not have happened if weed were accessible to these children!
The problem with these kids is that there parents abused heavy drugs themselves and neglected their own kids.
It waisnt just the goverment that intervened it was the tribal first nations inuit council of elders.
Now this thread started out as marijuna but I thought it would be appropiate to show other addictions.
6th June 2003, 5:19 PM
6th June 2003, 9:25 PM
7th June 2003, 3:19 AM
8th June 2003, 8:58 AM
9th June 2003, 4:01 AM
9th June 2003, 6:24 AM
9th June 2003, 6:29 AM
9th June 2003, 7:35 AM
9th June 2003, 11:07 AM
9th June 2003, 2:50 PM
2nd March 2007, 7:23 PM
Two-and-a-half-years? Aw, hell no. I've refined my self-confidence and debate skills since then (I'm the president of my school's chapter of NORML - National Organization to Reform Marijuana Laws :)), so I'll revive this topic (especially since there's been a frenzy of topic-revival going on in the past week). It randomly crossed my mind, so I decided to look at it again. Be prepared for a monolith of a post that's usually unlike me (since it's a topic that interests me; unfortunately, my interest in video games has waned in the past few years). Sorry for replying to posts from so long ago, as your viewpoints may very well have changed, but I saw some things that couldn’t go unanswered.
To me, "drug problem" encapsulates more than just the damage caused to the user. I won't argue about the legalization of all drugs, because I'm still quite ambivalent on the subject, but there's clearly a problem wrong with the policy of locking up non-violent drug offenders. Most drugs are linked to crime because they exist in the black market. Addiction is also certainly a problem with hard drugs, such as heroin, cocaine, and crystal meth, and I could see how theft and armed robbery is an issue with that. I think that's the extent of the argument I agree with, though. With controlled dosages, over-dosages would be a thing of the past, unless proper administration was circumvented. Purity would also no longer be a problem, as the FDA would treat these substances like our currently legal drugs. Also, if they were carefully regulated, a person could have a greater chance of intervention if the habit goes out of control. Of course, as a personal choice, I would never take a highly addictive drug. The libertarian in me says that drugs should be legal, but my compassion for fellow-man says otherwise.
I know you're not around anymore, but you're an asshole. I shouldn't have expected more from you. "OMG HE USES POT HE MUST BE A BURNOUT LOSER DUMMIEEIEEE!!!!11`1" As a regular cannabis smoker of more than 3 years, I resent that, you fucking idiot. I'd be more willing to take advice from a flower child who's lost his mind from taking too much lsd than you, buddy.
What a stupid ad. Kids shouldn't be smoking to begin with. I don't see how anyone could be high enough to willingly shoot himself with a gun, unless an emotional disorder (say, clinical depression) were exacerbated while under the effects of cannabis (in which case, he shouldn't be taking drugs that adversely affect his condition to begin with). The ad was clearly created by people who have minimal (if any at all) experience with marijuana.
Unfortunately, you can't blame drugs on your lack of grammar and logic.
Don't be so quick to put alcohol and grass into the same category. It's easy for me to hide the fact that I'm high, but it's typically easy to spot a drunkard within seconds of witnessing him.
Wow. Just, wow. Not only does that reek of (willful?) ignorance of the Temperance era, but it completely lacks compassion. Drug addiction is a disease, not a crime. The massive failure known as the War on Drugs should tell you that harsh sentences don’t stop people from using substances. Legislating morality of actions that don’t harm others is quite difficult, and in the case of addictive substances, people don’t even care as long as they get a fix.
Maybe… because… people… enjoy it? I’m going out on a limb here. Fast food is also unhealthy, but people still eat it, either out of convenience or enjoyment.
A common misconception not supported by facts. Marijuana is sold in small amounts in Amsterdam, and if I correctly recall, they have LESS of a percentage of people who smoke cannabis (at least a smaller percentage of teens – I’ll find a reference, if you wish).
Truth is, you’re already having your tax dollars wasting money on locking people up for a drug that’s hardly even a social hazard.
Good thing we're not talking about morphine!
Good thing anecdotal evidence is hardly pragmatic or empirical. The gateway and amotivational myths have never been proven by sound science. Your friends sound like idiots (they’re also minors using drugs, something I don’t condone). I can counter that with the same amount of credence with the fact that I’ve never met a single person (and this is out of dozens of potheads) who have stolen to support their habits.
What about tequila, vodka, rum, everclear, etc? What about schwag (low-potency weed) or middies (moderate-potency weed)? Why am I even replying to this?
THC metabolites stay in your system days after you’ve smoked. The high from cannabis typically only lasts a couple hours max (depending on dosage, potency, etc, of course).
…are you serious? Really? Ooookay… people like to alter their consciousnesses for a variety of reasons, most among them are relaxation and curiosity. I’m hoping that was rhetorical, though. Pot doesn’t make you more stupid (haha, I love irony) unless heavily abused (being high every minute of every day) OR kill you.
Ah, I can’t even address this type of ignorance from a poster who no longer visits.
That holds no relevance to marijuana, but it is indeed sad. Some people are just plain stupid. Research the things you put into your bodies, folks.
That’s too bad, buddy. I think people who don’t smoke weed are missing out on a very relaxing, amusing, and spiritually-fulfilling hobby. Of course, I don’t get up on a high horse and call them stupid.
There’s that self-righteous and misguided “OMG ALL POTHEADS ARE RETARDS” bullshit again. How about this – I respect your standpoint, and as long as I'm giving thoughtful and reasonable arguments, you respect mine. 'Kay?
Admittedly, you’ve got me there. But don’t forget about sequels!
You can do that with marijuana.
This is a problem with the law, not the hobby. What if the shoe were on the other foot and video games were illegal? What if there were unrealistic commercials depicting people sitting on their couches like zombies, playing round after round of Melee, ignoring their health? Well, I guess you’d be as dumb as me smoking weed for not being a good little drone who believes every single thing our government tells us! I’m not a huge conspiracy theorist, btw, but with marijuana policy, our government is FAR off the mark.
Ahh, don’t you love that? When you get addicted. You clearly have no experience with marijuana, aside from bullshit from D.A.R.E. and concerned parents. Allow me to make this nice and sparkingly clear – clear as an azure sky of deepest summer, clear as an unmuddled lake – POT IS NOT LIKE HEROIN. You do NOT get addicted from a single puff; not even close. However, I digress. It’s my choice what I spend my money on, just like it’s a fashion-freak’s choice to “waste” money on 20 wardrobes, and a gamer’s choice to “waste” money on video games, and a spectator's choice to "waste" money on attending sporting events.
Nope, can’t let this one go. Weed doesn’t make you do stupid things, like alcohol. Pot tends to increase caution and introspection from my experience, and if you take a look at the scientific abstracts or youtube video on driving with marijuana that I list further down the post, you’ll see some evidence on that. I have made the conscious choice to not drive when I was too high, even when peer-pressure was an issue. I have smoked and driven, and have had problems with it less than %2 of the time.
Stereotyping of cannabis smokers does nothing better than reveal the author’s ignorance on the subject. This is probably why I didn’t even bother responding to this before. Jackass.
Don't take all of this too personally, Eden. I still respect you, but if you really believe all this, then I simply cannot respect those particular beliefs. They reek of opinionated ignorance. It'd be one thing if you knew what you were talking about...
It doesn’t kill you in any way. Marijuana is not life-threatening itself. Nope, it doesn’t cause cancer. In fact, there's a NEGATIVE correlation with incidence of cancer (once again, I'll dig up a link if you desire).
Incorrect. As a completely different species of plant, the smoke from combusted tobacco has different effects on the body. Marijuana can perhaps inflict irritation to bronchial tubes, but emphysema and cancer are not an issue.
Not so fast. Sports CAN be harmful. People who have heart problems can be damaged from participating in sports. Some contain flying projectiles. Hunting can be dangerous - just ask Dick Cheney! Football, Rugby, Boxing, and Hockey are considerably dangerous to even healthy and fit people. How about extreme sports, like sky-diving, skateboarding, etc.? And pot doesn’t slowly kill you. There was a woman in India (I’ll find the article if you want) that reportedly lived to be over one-hundred years old who smoked weed every day.
Reality is a crutch for people who can't cope with drugs.
I don't believe that per se, but it's a funny saying nonetheless. How can you make such a statement, though (perhaps you've gained some common sense in the past two-and-a-half years, or at least greater caution to use blanket statements)? Perhaps it could be applied to heroin, something I don't have experience with (and never want it). But marijuana is arguably less harmful than alcohol. I'll propose the same question comedian Bill Hicks proposed: You're at a ball game or concert, and someone's acting really rowdy, violent, loud, and obnoxious - are they high or drunk? Mankind has had an interest in altering his own consciousness for millenia. There sure are a lot of weak-minded and weak-willed people out there for wanting to experience a different and virtually harmless mindset!
Have you ever seen people under the influence of cannabis get into fights? Unless a person is crazy to begin with, I can't imagine him under any circumstances smoking a joint and beating his wife and kids. Alcohol is an intoxicant, in the true sense that it's a toxic substance to your body. Cannabis is non-toxic, and impossible to overdose on. It's LD-50 is estimated to be in a range that's substantially greater than the normal dosage, or even the couch-lock, giggly, incapacitated-because-you're-still-a-newb-and-smoked-way-too-much dosage. You'd sooner die from drinking too much water.
You ever drink too much and feel like complete trash the next morning? Yup, it happens to the best of us who have a few too many. Headaches, nausea, depression, lethargy. You know what typically happens after I smoke too much weed? ...when I go to sleep, I don't awaken for perhaps a few hours later. I got light "hangovers" when I first began smoking, in the sense that I became slightly depressed the day afterwards (and no, not because I didn't have any more pot, so no smart-ass remarks ). They recently passed a meaningless (I'll get into why that's so if anyone here's interested, but probably not) cannabis paraphernalia ban here in Philadelphia. Thank god they're trying to protect children from people who giggle, relax, binge eat, philosophize, and take copious naps! Boy, that deadly cotton-mouth would be the downfall of society if weed were suddenly legalized, let me tell ya.
This is true, and to anyone who wants a reference, I'll be glad to find one for you: cannabis is less physically addictive than alcohol, tobacco, and caffiene. Psychological addiction is another ball of wax, but I'd still say such is comparable to alcohol.
I'm not saying grass is harmless (notice, I used the word virtually before). Moderation is the key, and there are substances out there (alcohol and tobacco included) that are MUCH more difficult to moderate. Do you know what the biggest barrier to easily moderating marijuana is? The fact that it doesn't make your body and mind feel like shit. The fact that you normally don't have to apologize for your unruly behavior the next day. The worst thing that marijuana could do to you is exacerbate predisposed mental illnesses. There is a strong correlation between people with mental illnesses and people who smoke, but correlation is not causation, and I think any reasonable person can agree that those with mental illnesses are more prone feel desire to find a substance that soothes them from their mental turmoil than an emotionally stable person. Marijuana does lower sperm count (but still makes for a poor contraceptive, I'm sure), but that reverses when the user quits. A long-term, heavy user could perhaps experience permanent but insubstantial deficits in short-term memory after quitting, but again, moderation is the key. If that's the worst that could happen from smoking too much, why the hell isn't it alcohol that's illegal? (rhetorical question - it's obvious that cultural significance is the reason it's legal)
If cannabis were legal, not only would we be giving people a better choice in consciousness-altering substances (sorry, I can't bring myself to use the word "intoxicant"), but we'd stop wasting money on non-violent drug offenders, effectively taking a huge cash crop out of the hands of criminals and other members of the black market. Our national deficit is at 8.7 trillion dollars, and I think it's high time we not only infuse some common sense in a rigid and hypocritical drug policy, but help combat our debts. The economical benefits to cannabis legalization isn't even an original idea, either. Milton Friedman, Nobel laureate and all-around brilliant and well-respected economist, supported this idea in a Forbes article in 2005.
For those of you jumping to say "But Dan, if weed were legalized, more people would be toking up and driving killing people and it'd be a huge disaster! What if there are CHILDREN IN THE CAR?!!?"
(sorry to pigeon-hole anyone who would have brought up marijuana and driving, but this is a common and specious argument that appeals to emotions instead of logic)
There are laws in place for drugged driving, in case you haven't noticed. Simple tests given by the police officer should determine if a person is incapacitated to a degree in which operating a motor vehicle is unsafe. How does that contradict what substances should be prohibited? Now, while I absolutely do not condone altering one's consciousness while operating machinery that puts the lives of others at risk, I can tell you with 100% certainty that, given a pair of options that I *must* choose from, I would much rather take a ride with a high driver than a drunk driver (if they're on, roughly, the same level of dosage). I'll include the appropriate references:
http://www3.interscience.wiley.com/cgi-b...1&SRETRY=0
http://www.ukcia.org/research/driving.htm
And, in case your attention span is short:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CfcRyruo91Y
Here's a few other myths that I'm willing to dispel, if anyone disagrees:
-Marijuana is a gate-way drug
-Marijuana kills brain cells
-Marijuana causes cancer and emphysema
-Marijuana is a drug without therapeutic value
-Marijuana today is much more potent and harmful than back it the 60s (my father, who has again taken to smoking since retirement on a bi-weekly basis, was there and has told me personally that this is bullshit)
-Marijuana causes amotivational syndrome (perhaps true to a small extent, but I doubt a greater threat than alcohol)
Whew! Okay, I'm done. Sorry for such a long post. I hope someone is passionate enough on this subject, be it a position of concurrence or discordance with my viewpoint, that they'll actually read through it. Hopefully, ultimately, someone will learn something (but being that this forum doesn't contain many drug-users, including alcohol which is most certainly a drug, that likely isn't the case).
Quote:I know Jean Cretin is pretty stupid even for a commie lib, but the logic of this makes no sense to me. Decrease the drug problem by making them legal? Wow hey, great logic. You know, if you inject cyanide into someone's veins, their malignant cancer or HIV won't be bothering them very long either!
To me, "drug problem" encapsulates more than just the damage caused to the user. I won't argue about the legalization of all drugs, because I'm still quite ambivalent on the subject, but there's clearly a problem wrong with the policy of locking up non-violent drug offenders. Most drugs are linked to crime because they exist in the black market. Addiction is also certainly a problem with hard drugs, such as heroin, cocaine, and crystal meth, and I could see how theft and armed robbery is an issue with that. I think that's the extent of the argument I agree with, though. With controlled dosages, over-dosages would be a thing of the past, unless proper administration was circumvented. Purity would also no longer be a problem, as the FDA would treat these substances like our currently legal drugs. Also, if they were carefully regulated, a person could have a greater chance of intervention if the habit goes out of control. Of course, as a personal choice, I would never take a highly addictive drug. The libertarian in me says that drugs should be legal, but my compassion for fellow-man says otherwise.
Quote:Plus I dont see why the PM would want to take advice from people who smoke weed.
I know you're not around anymore, but you're an asshole. I shouldn't have expected more from you. "OMG HE USES POT HE MUST BE A BURNOUT LOSER DUMMIEEIEEE!!!!11`1" As a regular cannabis smoker of more than 3 years, I resent that, you fucking idiot. I'd be more willing to take advice from a flower child who's lost his mind from taking too much lsd than you, buddy.Quote:This new bill was not needed as pot isnt a problem , I like that anti drug abuse ad in the U.S were a kid shoots himself dead being so high on weed thought the gun was a cap gun.
What a stupid ad. Kids shouldn't be smoking to begin with. I don't see how anyone could be high enough to willingly shoot himself with a gun, unless an emotional disorder (say, clinical depression) were exacerbated while under the effects of cannabis (in which case, he shouldn't be taking drugs that adversely affect his condition to begin with). The ad was clearly created by people who have minimal (if any at all) experience with marijuana.
Quote:Jean Chreitian undoubtly smokes weed , why else do such absurdity.
Unfortunately, you can't blame drugs on your lack of grammar and logic.
Quote:Alcohol in my opinion is far more dangerous and destructive than tobacco, and it's funny how not only does the government ignore alcohol, it also is sympathetic to weed, both being substances that can rob you of your cognitive ability and can impair your ability to operate a vehicle or even walk straight
Don't be so quick to put alcohol and grass into the same category. It's easy for me to hide the fact that I'm high, but it's typically easy to spot a drunkard within seconds of witnessing him.
Quote:Actually, I'm in favor of making illegal drug trafficking a capital crime, as that practice is responsible for (wild guess) a good half of the murders in America. Our legal system needs to get it's priorities in check and start going after the root of the problem. In China, possession of weed carries a mandatory seven year sentence, and dealers of that and others are executed. For once, they have the right idea.
Wow. Just, wow. Not only does that reek of (willful?) ignorance of the Temperance era, but it completely lacks compassion. Drug addiction is a disease, not a crime. The massive failure known as the War on Drugs should tell you that harsh sentences don’t stop people from using substances. Legislating morality of actions that don’t harm others is quite difficult, and in the case of addictive substances, people don’t even care as long as they get a fix.
Quote:To be honest, my plan would just make it impossible to get a cig, not make it illegal . I just wanna know why they don't just all get on the patch. They get nicotine, and they don't HAVE to quit then, plus I don't have a single complaint. I think the main reason alcohol is still legal is because we all know just how well making it illegal went last time they tried it...
Maybe… because… people… enjoy it? I’m going out on a limb here. Fast food is also unhealthy, but people still eat it, either out of convenience or enjoyment.
Quote: As for Canada decriminalizing marijuana, its not a good step... for one it'll mean it will be far easier to get it into the US -- like we needed a bigger drug problem! And for Canada, while it'll lead to less crime because of drug lords, probably, it will also increase the number of addicted people... NOT A GOOD THING!
A common misconception not supported by facts. Marijuana is sold in small amounts in Amsterdam, and if I correctly recall, they have LESS of a percentage of people who smoke cannabis (at least a smaller percentage of teens – I’ll find a reference, if you wish).
Quote: "Truth is I refuse to have my tax dollars go to Rehab fucks who dont take care of themselves".
Truth is, you’re already having your tax dollars wasting money on locking people up for a drug that’s hardly even a social hazard.
Quote: I was on medicated Morphiene(i dont think I spelled that right).
I can say it is pretty easy to be a heartless killer when your high on that stuff, Your concious is gone for a short period.
I was glad to be off that after my surgerey as I was going nuts.
Good thing we're not talking about morphine!
Quote:But the people who I know who smoke weed are always lazy bastards who are unproductive ,Though I find it amusing to hear their stories about how stoned they were. They always seem sluggish and dead afterwards.Alot of people I know who do weed have also tried Coke and acid, I just feel Marayuna is just the key to further more serious things.
There was a 12 year old boy in our town who broke into houses to steal VCRS and Tvs so he could get enough money to buy some more Pot to feed is drug habbait.
Ive seen tons of freinds steal school equipement to pay off some buddy who gave them that gram of good weed the other night.
Good thing anecdotal evidence is hardly pragmatic or empirical.
The gateway and amotivational myths have never been proven by sound science. Your friends sound like idiots (they’re also minors using drugs, something I don’t condone). I can counter that with the same amount of credence with the fact that I’ve never met a single person (and this is out of dozens of potheads) who have stolen to support their habits.Quote:But unlike weed it isnt potent in such tiny doses.
What about tequila, vodka, rum, everclear, etc? What about schwag (low-potency weed) or middies (moderate-potency weed)? Why am I even replying to this?
Quote:Weed stays in your system and effect you even days after you last toked up, were as beer wares off the next day.
THC metabolites stay in your system days after you’ve smoked. The high from cannabis typically only lasts a couple hours max (depending on dosage, potency, etc, of course).
Quote: Well I have no personal experience with alchohol (I turn 21 in 2 1/2 months, but have no intention of drinking anytime soon), tobacco, or marijuana... and plan to keep it that way. I don't see why people would do those things... all it does is make you stupider and/or kill you...
…are you serious? Really? Ooookay… people like to alter their consciousnesses for a variety of reasons, most among them are relaxation and curiosity. I’m hoping that was rhetorical, though. Pot doesn’t make you more stupid (haha, I love irony) unless heavily abused (being high every minute of every day) OR kill you.
Quote: If you just ate jars full of salt that could kill you if you overdose on it . There is no such thing as recreational or Casual Marijuna you do have a dependency on it.When ever somthing goes bad you go to the drugs , You have a hard addiction you should'nt be a fool to underestimate it.
Ah, I can’t even address this type of ignorance from a poster who no longer visits.Quote:There's this guy in our town who used to be smart, but then he spent lots of time sniffing paint and basically blew out his mind... he's still around but is stupid and can't hold a job or an apartment because of how he is... its sad, but it IS his own fault...
That holds no relevance to marijuana, but it is indeed sad. Some people are just plain stupid. Research the things you put into your bodies, folks.
Quote: Is smoking marijuana evil? Not at all. Is it monumentally stupid? In every conceivable way. I can't come up with a single reason why I'd want to injest something which could potentially be dangerous to myself and others.
That’s too bad, buddy. I think people who don’t smoke weed are missing out on a very relaxing, amusing, and spiritually-fulfilling hobby. Of course, I don’t get up on a high horse and call them stupid.
Quote:I'd rather play Melee. Lets do a comparison, shall we? Try and stay with me, potheads, I'll speak slowly.
There’s that self-righteous and misguided “OMG ALL POTHEADS ARE RETARDS” bullshit again. How about this – I respect your standpoint, and as long as I'm giving thoughtful and reasonable arguments, you respect mine. 'Kay?
Quote: Super Smash Bros. Melee: One time cost, then you can enjoy it anytime you wish.
Admittedly, you’ve got me there. But don’t forget about sequels!
Quote:You can enjoy it with friends or alone
You can do that with marijuana.
Quote:, and best of all, if a cop pulls you over and you've got a copy of Melee, you won't get punished (unless the cop is a PS2 or XBox fanboy)
This is a problem with the law, not the hobby. What if the shoe were on the other foot and video games were illegal? What if there were unrealistic commercials depicting people sitting on their couches like zombies, playing round after round of Melee, ignoring their health? Well, I guess you’d be as dumb as me smoking weed for not being a good little drone who believes every single thing our government tells us! I’m not a huge conspiracy theorist, btw, but with marijuana policy, our government is FAR off the mark.
Quote: and when you get addicted, it adds up.
Ahh, don’t you love that? When you get addicted. You clearly have no experience with marijuana, aside from bullshit from D.A.R.E. and concerned parents. Allow me to make this nice and sparkingly clear – clear as an azure sky of deepest summer, clear as an unmuddled lake – POT IS NOT LIKE HEROIN. You do NOT get addicted from a single puff; not even close. However, I digress. It’s my choice what I spend my money on, just like it’s a fashion-freak’s choice to “waste” money on 20 wardrobes, and a gamer’s choice to “waste” money on video games, and a spectator's choice to "waste" money on attending sporting events.
Quote: What kills you is the stupid shit you think you can do when you're high on it, like drive.
Nope, can’t let this one go. Weed doesn’t make you do stupid things, like alcohol. Pot tends to increase caution and introspection from my experience, and if you take a look at the scientific abstracts or youtube video on driving with marijuana that I list further down the post, you’ll see some evidence on that. I have made the conscious choice to not drive when I was too high, even when peer-pressure was an issue. I have smoked and driven, and have had problems with it less than %2 of the time.
Quote: So if you want to smoke pot, you go right ahead. I think of it as weeding out the weak and stupid.
Stereotyping of cannabis smokers does nothing better than reveal the author’s ignorance on the subject. This is probably why I didn’t even bother responding to this before. Jackass.
Don't take all of this too personally, Eden. I still respect you, but if you really believe all this, then I simply cannot respect those particular beliefs. They reek of opinionated ignorance. It'd be one thing if you knew what you were talking about...
Quote: Marijuana may be slightly less evil than other drugs because it doesn't kill you directly. Oh joy. That is such a great endorsement! Its slightly less bad for you !
It doesn’t kill you in any way. Marijuana is not life-threatening itself. Nope, it doesn’t cause cancer. In fact, there's a NEGATIVE correlation with incidence of cancer (once again, I'll dig up a link if you desire).
Quote: Thing about pot is that you're still SMOKING it, and thus all the bad effects of smoke in your lungs are there, thus pot can still kill you using one of the ways cigarette smoking kills people.
Incorrect. As a completely different species of plant, the smoke from combusted tobacco has different effects on the body. Marijuana can perhaps inflict irritation to bronchial tubes, but emphysema and cancer are not an issue.
Quote: Lots of things are "fun" that shouldn't be done. Drugs are one of those. Comparing it to sports? Uhh... sports don't slowly kill you... drugs do. Any drugs. They should all be either illegal or perscription...
Not so fast. Sports CAN be harmful. People who have heart problems can be damaged from participating in sports. Some contain flying projectiles. Hunting can be dangerous - just ask Dick Cheney! Football, Rugby, Boxing, and Hockey are considerably dangerous to even healthy and fit people. How about extreme sports, like sky-diving, skateboarding, etc.? And pot doesn’t slowly kill you. There was a woman in India (I’ll find the article if you want) that reportedly lived to be over one-hundred years old who smoked weed every day.
Quote: Amen.
Quote:Absolutely.
Quote:Drugs are for the weak-minded and the weak-willed
Reality is a crutch for people who can't cope with drugs.I don't believe that per se, but it's a funny saying nonetheless. How can you make such a statement, though (perhaps you've gained some common sense in the past two-and-a-half years, or at least greater caution to use blanket statements)? Perhaps it could be applied to heroin, something I don't have experience with (and never want it). But marijuana is arguably less harmful than alcohol. I'll propose the same question comedian Bill Hicks proposed: You're at a ball game or concert, and someone's acting really rowdy, violent, loud, and obnoxious - are they high or drunk? Mankind has had an interest in altering his own consciousness for millenia. There sure are a lot of weak-minded and weak-willed people out there for wanting to experience a different and virtually harmless mindset!
Have you ever seen people under the influence of cannabis get into fights? Unless a person is crazy to begin with, I can't imagine him under any circumstances smoking a joint and beating his wife and kids. Alcohol is an intoxicant, in the true sense that it's a toxic substance to your body. Cannabis is non-toxic, and impossible to overdose on. It's LD-50 is estimated to be in a range that's substantially greater than the normal dosage, or even the couch-lock, giggly, incapacitated-because-you're-still-a-newb-and-smoked-way-too-much dosage. You'd sooner die from drinking too much water.
You ever drink too much and feel like complete trash the next morning? Yup, it happens to the best of us who have a few too many. Headaches, nausea, depression, lethargy. You know what typically happens after I smoke too much weed? ...when I go to sleep, I don't awaken for perhaps a few hours later. I got light "hangovers" when I first began smoking, in the sense that I became slightly depressed the day afterwards (and no, not because I didn't have any more pot, so no smart-ass remarks
). They recently passed a meaningless (I'll get into why that's so if anyone here's interested, but probably not) cannabis paraphernalia ban here in Philadelphia. Thank god they're trying to protect children from people who giggle, relax, binge eat, philosophize, and take copious naps! Boy, that deadly cotton-mouth would be the downfall of society if weed were suddenly legalized, let me tell ya.This is true, and to anyone who wants a reference, I'll be glad to find one for you: cannabis is less physically addictive than alcohol, tobacco, and caffiene. Psychological addiction is another ball of wax, but I'd still say such is comparable to alcohol.
I'm not saying grass is harmless (notice, I used the word virtually before). Moderation is the key, and there are substances out there (alcohol and tobacco included) that are MUCH more difficult to moderate. Do you know what the biggest barrier to easily moderating marijuana is? The fact that it doesn't make your body and mind feel like shit. The fact that you normally don't have to apologize for your unruly behavior the next day. The worst thing that marijuana could do to you is exacerbate predisposed mental illnesses. There is a strong correlation between people with mental illnesses and people who smoke, but correlation is not causation, and I think any reasonable person can agree that those with mental illnesses are more prone feel desire to find a substance that soothes them from their mental turmoil than an emotionally stable person. Marijuana does lower sperm count (but still makes for a poor contraceptive, I'm sure), but that reverses when the user quits. A long-term, heavy user could perhaps experience permanent but insubstantial deficits in short-term memory after quitting, but again, moderation is the key. If that's the worst that could happen from smoking too much, why the hell isn't it alcohol that's illegal? (rhetorical question - it's obvious that cultural significance is the reason it's legal)
If cannabis were legal, not only would we be giving people a better choice in consciousness-altering substances (sorry, I can't bring myself to use the word "intoxicant"), but we'd stop wasting money on non-violent drug offenders, effectively taking a huge cash crop out of the hands of criminals and other members of the black market. Our national deficit is at 8.7 trillion dollars, and I think it's high time we not only infuse some common sense in a rigid and hypocritical drug policy, but help combat our debts. The economical benefits to cannabis legalization isn't even an original idea, either. Milton Friedman, Nobel laureate and all-around brilliant and well-respected economist, supported this idea in a Forbes article in 2005.
For those of you jumping to say "But Dan, if weed were legalized, more people would be toking up and driving killing people and it'd be a huge disaster! What if there are CHILDREN IN THE CAR?!!?"
(sorry to pigeon-hole anyone who would have brought up marijuana and driving, but this is a common and specious argument that appeals to emotions instead of logic)
There are laws in place for drugged driving, in case you haven't noticed. Simple tests given by the police officer should determine if a person is incapacitated to a degree in which operating a motor vehicle is unsafe. How does that contradict what substances should be prohibited? Now, while I absolutely do not condone altering one's consciousness while operating machinery that puts the lives of others at risk, I can tell you with 100% certainty that, given a pair of options that I *must* choose from, I would much rather take a ride with a high driver than a drunk driver (if they're on, roughly, the same level of dosage). I'll include the appropriate references:
http://www3.interscience.wiley.com/cgi-b...1&SRETRY=0
http://www.ukcia.org/research/driving.htm
And, in case your attention span is short:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CfcRyruo91Y
Here's a few other myths that I'm willing to dispel, if anyone disagrees:
-Marijuana is a gate-way drug
-Marijuana kills brain cells
-Marijuana causes cancer and emphysema
-Marijuana is a drug without therapeutic value
-Marijuana today is much more potent and harmful than back it the 60s (my father, who has again taken to smoking since retirement on a bi-weekly basis, was there and has told me personally that this is bullshit)
-Marijuana causes amotivational syndrome (perhaps true to a small extent, but I doubt a greater threat than alcohol)
Whew! Okay, I'm done. Sorry for such a long post. I hope someone is passionate enough on this subject, be it a position of concurrence or discordance with my viewpoint, that they'll actually read through it. Hopefully, ultimately, someone will learn something (but being that this forum doesn't contain many drug-users, including alcohol which is most certainly a drug, that likely isn't the case).
5th March 2007, 5:25 PM
5th March 2007, 5:50 PM
5th March 2007, 5:55 PM
5th March 2007, 6:32 PM
Quote:That was the single greatest post in Tendo City history. I'm gonna go smoke a big fucking blunt to that.
Jesus take a bow, you deserve it for single-handedly owning every close-minded holier-than-thou asshole on this site who thinks that smoking weed is bad.
Fuck all you assholes who look down on somebody else because of their personal choices.
I'm glad someone else here is sane.
Quote:Eh, this childish question again... Yeah this is right up there on my "I really just don't care list" with "why can I go to war but I can't drink?", which is something a person cares about for exactly 3 years and then never again. Suck it up, on both accounts. (Not literally.)
And why, pray tell, is this a childish question? Fighting for liberty and pursuit of happiness, though involving something that isn't a necessity for survival, is far from childish. Maybe this doesn't affect you, but that's no reason to minimize the issue. There's clearly a substantial portion of people who disagree with these laws (last I heard, around 33% agreed with taxing and regulating cannabis like alcohol).
I'm sure you feel passionate about stopping people like Jack Thompson, DJ, because it affects a hobby that you partake in. But suddenly, if someone wishes to pursue another hobby of altering his consciousness, it becomes "childish".
I'm sure I could find many, many people (outside our age group, of course) who agree that playing video games is "childish". What makes your hobby any less childish than mine?5th March 2007, 6:42 PM
5th March 2007, 6:44 PM
5th March 2007, 6:57 PM
Quote:The brain is malfunctioning as you are applying doses you aren't even properly measuring out, nor do you know the actual effect it may produce.
Well, that's funny... people have been consuming cannabis for millennia, but users still don't have a way of properly measuring it out, or knowing the actual effects it produces. ...huh?
I honestly expected you to present a more challenging argument, DJ...Quote:No scientific rigor is being applied in this attempt to mess with your BRAIN, the very seat of what makes you you.
From http://www.mikuriya.com/cw_depend.html :
Quote:The complex interplay of cannabis use with physiology and psychology challenges research. Outcomes are combinations of pharmacology, expectations, setting, personal and social forces. The contemporary ambiguity, a product of ignorance from deprivation of contemporary clinical experience, may be somewhat assuaged by two facts: Firstly, cannabis has been used for millennia by numerous cultures without serious adverse consequences. Secondly, neither the composition of cannabis nor the physiology of humans have changed since the drug was taken from the armementarium of medicine.
Quote:That's what makes it more childish. I'm sure you are feeling some odd emotions as parts of your brain are triggered to fire in an uncontrolled manner, including the inhibition center of your brain, but this isn't some path to "other ways of knowing", because only empiricism works.
Cannabis doesn't inhibit the pathways of neural networks, though. Alcohol and tobacco do, as far as I know, but not cannabis.
5th March 2007, 6:59 PM
5th March 2007, 7:01 PM
5th March 2007, 7:07 PM
5th March 2007, 7:15 PM
5th March 2007, 7:22 PM
5th March 2007, 8:12 PM
5th March 2007, 9:23 PM
5th March 2007, 9:46 PM
Let me pose this question SJ....
You say you drove stoned off your ass with no insident while high on marijuana.
How the hell do you know your drive was with out incident? You where stoned off your ass being stupid!
You could have murdered fifty people and not realized it cause you where stoned off your ass. Not to mention that being stoned certainly does nothing for the reflexes, timing, coordination, reaction time all crucial to driving. No doubt you ran several red lights and almost caused numerous traffic accidents and didn't realize it. You probably didn't hear anything about it or assume it was without incident, because there where enough clear headed drivers out that night to get the hell out of your way.
I'm staying the hell off the road when your pot head ass comes driving by!
You say you where clear headed while smoking pot. But You where high as well Your senses where also imparted. I did need the personal experiences of person in a drug induced state, I will not and can not except that as evidence to the contrary. I choose to rely on empirical evidence, the facts of pot smoking are in abundance.
Marijuana Dangers
![[Image: rule.gif]](http://www.marijuana-detox.com/img/rule.gif)
Marijuana has many dangers; through both immediate effects and damage to health over time.
Marijuana hinders the user's short-term memory (memory for recent events), and he or she may have trouble handling complex tasks. With the use of more potent varieties of marijuana, even simple tasks can be difficult.
Because of the drug's effects on perceptions and reaction time, users could be involved in auto crashes. Drug users also may become involved in risky sexual behavior. There is a strong link between drug use and unsafe sex and the spread of HIV, the virus that causes AIDS.
Under the influence of marijuana, students may find it hard to study and learn. Young athletes could find their performance is off; timing, movements, and coordination are all affected by THC.
Marijuana affects many skills required for safe driving: alertness, the ability to concentrate, coordination, and reaction time. These effects can last up to 24 hours after smoking marijuana. Marijuana use can make it difficult to judge distances and react to signals and sounds on the road.
There is data showing that marijuana can play a role in crashes. When users combine marijuana with alcohol, as they often do, the hazards of driving can be more severe than with either drug alone.
A study of patients in a shock-trauma unit who had been in traffic accidents revealed that 15 percent of those who had been driving a car or motorcycle had been smoking marijuana, and another 17 percent had both THC and alcohol in their blood.
In one study conducted in Memphis, TN, researchers found that, of 150 reckless drivers who were tested for drugs at the arrest scene, 33 percent tested positive for marijuana, and 12 percent tested positive for both marijuana and cocaine. Data also show that while smoking marijuana, people show the same lack of coordination on standard "drunk driver" tests as do people who have had too much to drink.
Smoking any drug is unhealthy. Marijuana is no exception. The smoke actually contains higher concentrations of carcinogenic polycyclic aromatic hydrocarbons (PAHs) than tobacco smoke. Marijuana smokers generally inhale more smoke for longer depositing more than 4 times as much tar on their lungs as cigarette smokers.
Worse is if you combine marijuana and tobacco. If you are a heavy smoker of marijuana and tobacco joints (more than 10 a day) you are significantly increasing your risk of contracting lung disease. Recent studies show that the greatest pre-cancerous abnormalities appear in those who smoke the two drugs together.
A common side-effect, usually for first time or early users, is anxiety, panic, paranoia and feelings of impending doom. In a recent study, between 10%-15% of people who smoked marijuana reported "paranoid" or "confused" feelings as a disadvantage of smoking marijuana. And over 27% reported "anxiety" as a regular or occasional effect. Around 30% gave "negative experiences" as their reason for permanently quitting marijuana.
Effects on the Brain
Scientists have learned a great deal about how THC acts in the brain to produce its many effects. When someone smokes marijuana, THC rapidly passes from the lungs into the bloodstream, which carries the chemical to organs throughout the body, including the brain.
In the brain, THC connects to specific sites called cannabinoid receptors on nerve cells and influences the activity of those cells. Some brain areas have many cannabinoid receptors; others have few or none. Many cannabinoid receptors are found in the parts of the brain that influence pleasure, memory, thought, concentration, sensory and time perception, and coordinated movement.
The short-term effects of marijuana use can include problems with memory and learning; distorted perception; difficulty in thinking and problem solving; loss of coordination; and increased heart rate. Research findings for long-term marijuana use indicate some changes in the brain similar to those seen after long-term use of other major drugs of abuse. For example, cannabinoid (THC or synthetic forms of THC) withdrawal in chronically exposed animals leads to an increase in the activation of the stress-response system and changes in the activity of nerve cells containing dopamine. Dopamine neurons are involved in the regulation of motivation and reward, and are directly or indirectly affected by all drugs of abuse.
Effects on the Heart
One study has indicated that a user’s risk of heart attack more than quadruples in the first hour after smoking marijuana. The researchers suggest that such an effect might occur from marijuana’s effects on blood pressure and heart rate and reduced oxygen-carrying capacity of blood.
Effects on the Lungs
A study of 450 individuals found that people who smoke marijuana frequently but do not smoke tobacco have more health problems and miss more days of work than nonsmokers. Many of the extra sick days among the marijuana smokers in the study were for respiratory illnesses.
Even infrequent use can cause burning and stinging of the mouth and throat, often accompanied by a heavy cough. Someone who smokes marijuana regularly may have many of the same respiratory problems that tobacco smokers do, such as daily cough and phlegm production, more frequent acute chest illness, a heightened risk of lung infections, and a greater tendency to obstructed airways.
Cancer of the respiratory tract and lungs may also be promoted by marijuana smoke. A study comparing 173 cancer patients and 176 healthy individuals produced strong evidence that smoking marijuana increases the likelihood of developing cancer of the head or neck, and the more marijuana smoked the greater the increase. A statistical analysis of the data suggested that marijuana smoking doubled or tripled the risk of these cancers.
Marijuana use has the potential to promote cancer of the lungs and other parts of the respiratory tract because it contains irritants and carcinogens. In fact, marijuana smoke contains 50 to 70 percent more carcinogenic hydrocarbons than does tobacco smoke. It also produces high levels of an enzyme that converts certain hydrocarbons into their carcinogenic form—levels that may accelerate the changes that ultimately produce malignant cells. Marijuana users usually inhale more deeply and hold their breath longer than tobacco smokers do, which increases the lungs’ exposure to carcinogenic smoke. These facts suggest that, puff for puff, smoking marijuana may increase the risk of cancer more than smoking tobacco.
Other Health Effects
Some of marijuana's adverse health effects may occur because THC impairs the immune system’s ability to fight off infectious diseases and cancer. In laboratory experiments that exposed animal and human cells to THC or other marijuana ingredients, the normal disease-preventing reactions of many of the key types of immune cells were inhibited. In other studies, mice exposed to THC or related substances were more likely than unexposed mice to develop bacterial infections and tumors.
Effects of Heavy Marijuana Use on Learning and Social Behavior
Depression, anxiety, and personality disturbances are all associated with marijuana use. Research clearly demonstrates that marijuana use has potential to cause problems in daily life or make a person’s existing problems worse. Because marijuana compromises the ability to learn and remember information, the more a person uses marijuana the more he or she is likely to fall behind in accumulating intellectual, job, or social skills. Moreover, research has shown that marijuana’s adverse impact on memory and learning can last for days or weeks after the acute effects of the drug wear off.
Students who smoke marijuana get lower grades and are less likely to graduate from high school, compared to their non-smoking peers. In one study, researchers compared marijuana-smoking and non-smoking 12th-graders’ scores on standardized tests of verbal and mathematical skills. Although all of the students had scored equally well in 4th grade, the marijuana smokers’ scores were significantly lower in 12th grade.
A study of 129 college students found that, for heavy users of marijuana (those who smoked the drug at least 27 of the preceding 30 days), critical skills related to attention, memory, and learning were significantly impaired even after they had not used the drug for at least 24 hours. The heavy marijuana users in the study had more trouble sustaining and shifting their attention and in registering, organizing, and using information than did the study participants who had used marijuana no more than 3 of the previous 30 days. As a result, someone who smokes marijuana once daily may be functioning at a reduced intellectual level all of the time.
More recently, the same researchers showed that the ability of a group of long-term heavy marijuana users to recall words from a list remained impaired for a week after quitting, but returned to normal within 4 weeks. An implication of this finding is that some cognitive abilities may be restored in individuals who quit smoking marijuana, even after long-term heavy use.
Workers who smoke marijuana are more likely than their coworkers to have problems on the job. Several studies associate workers' marijuana smoking with increased absences, tardiness, accidents, workers' compensation claims, and job turnover. A study of municipal workers found that those who used marijuana on or off the job reported more "withdrawal behaviors"—such as leaving work without permission, daydreaming, spending work time on personal matters, and shirking tasks—that adversely affect productivity and morale.
Effects on Pregnancy
Research has shown that babies born to women who used marijuana during their pregnancies display altered responses to visual stimuli, increased tremulousness, and a high-pitched cry, which may indicate problems with neurological development. During infancy and preschool years, marijuana-exposed children have been observed to have more behavioral problems and poorer performance on tasks of visual perception, language comprehension, sustained attention, and memory. In school, these children are more likely to exhibit deficits in decision-making skills, memory, and the ability to remain attentive.
Addictive Potential
Long-term marijuana use can lead to addiction for some people; that is, they use the drug compulsively even though it often interferes with family, school, work, and recreational activities. Drug craving and withdrawal symptoms can make it hard for long-term marijuana smokers to stop using the drug. People trying to quit report irritability, sleeplessness, and anxiety(38). They also display increased aggression on psychological tests, peaking approximately one week after the last use of the drug(39).
Source:
http://www.marijuana-detox.com/m-dangers.htm
You say you drove stoned off your ass with no insident while high on marijuana.
How the hell do you know your drive was with out incident? You where stoned off your ass being stupid!
You could have murdered fifty people and not realized it cause you where stoned off your ass. Not to mention that being stoned certainly does nothing for the reflexes, timing, coordination, reaction time all crucial to driving. No doubt you ran several red lights and almost caused numerous traffic accidents and didn't realize it. You probably didn't hear anything about it or assume it was without incident, because there where enough clear headed drivers out that night to get the hell out of your way.
I'm staying the hell off the road when your pot head ass comes driving by!
You say you where clear headed while smoking pot. But You where high as well Your senses where also imparted. I did need the personal experiences of person in a drug induced state, I will not and can not except that as evidence to the contrary. I choose to rely on empirical evidence, the facts of pot smoking are in abundance.
Marijuana Dangers
Marijuana has many dangers; through both immediate effects and damage to health over time.
Marijuana hinders the user's short-term memory (memory for recent events), and he or she may have trouble handling complex tasks. With the use of more potent varieties of marijuana, even simple tasks can be difficult.
Because of the drug's effects on perceptions and reaction time, users could be involved in auto crashes. Drug users also may become involved in risky sexual behavior. There is a strong link between drug use and unsafe sex and the spread of HIV, the virus that causes AIDS.
Under the influence of marijuana, students may find it hard to study and learn. Young athletes could find their performance is off; timing, movements, and coordination are all affected by THC.
Marijuana affects many skills required for safe driving: alertness, the ability to concentrate, coordination, and reaction time. These effects can last up to 24 hours after smoking marijuana. Marijuana use can make it difficult to judge distances and react to signals and sounds on the road.
There is data showing that marijuana can play a role in crashes. When users combine marijuana with alcohol, as they often do, the hazards of driving can be more severe than with either drug alone.
A study of patients in a shock-trauma unit who had been in traffic accidents revealed that 15 percent of those who had been driving a car or motorcycle had been smoking marijuana, and another 17 percent had both THC and alcohol in their blood.
In one study conducted in Memphis, TN, researchers found that, of 150 reckless drivers who were tested for drugs at the arrest scene, 33 percent tested positive for marijuana, and 12 percent tested positive for both marijuana and cocaine. Data also show that while smoking marijuana, people show the same lack of coordination on standard "drunk driver" tests as do people who have had too much to drink.
Smoking any drug is unhealthy. Marijuana is no exception. The smoke actually contains higher concentrations of carcinogenic polycyclic aromatic hydrocarbons (PAHs) than tobacco smoke. Marijuana smokers generally inhale more smoke for longer depositing more than 4 times as much tar on their lungs as cigarette smokers.
Worse is if you combine marijuana and tobacco. If you are a heavy smoker of marijuana and tobacco joints (more than 10 a day) you are significantly increasing your risk of contracting lung disease. Recent studies show that the greatest pre-cancerous abnormalities appear in those who smoke the two drugs together.
A common side-effect, usually for first time or early users, is anxiety, panic, paranoia and feelings of impending doom. In a recent study, between 10%-15% of people who smoked marijuana reported "paranoid" or "confused" feelings as a disadvantage of smoking marijuana. And over 27% reported "anxiety" as a regular or occasional effect. Around 30% gave "negative experiences" as their reason for permanently quitting marijuana.
Effects on the Brain
Scientists have learned a great deal about how THC acts in the brain to produce its many effects. When someone smokes marijuana, THC rapidly passes from the lungs into the bloodstream, which carries the chemical to organs throughout the body, including the brain.
In the brain, THC connects to specific sites called cannabinoid receptors on nerve cells and influences the activity of those cells. Some brain areas have many cannabinoid receptors; others have few or none. Many cannabinoid receptors are found in the parts of the brain that influence pleasure, memory, thought, concentration, sensory and time perception, and coordinated movement.
The short-term effects of marijuana use can include problems with memory and learning; distorted perception; difficulty in thinking and problem solving; loss of coordination; and increased heart rate. Research findings for long-term marijuana use indicate some changes in the brain similar to those seen after long-term use of other major drugs of abuse. For example, cannabinoid (THC or synthetic forms of THC) withdrawal in chronically exposed animals leads to an increase in the activation of the stress-response system and changes in the activity of nerve cells containing dopamine. Dopamine neurons are involved in the regulation of motivation and reward, and are directly or indirectly affected by all drugs of abuse.
Effects on the Heart
One study has indicated that a user’s risk of heart attack more than quadruples in the first hour after smoking marijuana. The researchers suggest that such an effect might occur from marijuana’s effects on blood pressure and heart rate and reduced oxygen-carrying capacity of blood.
Effects on the Lungs
A study of 450 individuals found that people who smoke marijuana frequently but do not smoke tobacco have more health problems and miss more days of work than nonsmokers. Many of the extra sick days among the marijuana smokers in the study were for respiratory illnesses.
Even infrequent use can cause burning and stinging of the mouth and throat, often accompanied by a heavy cough. Someone who smokes marijuana regularly may have many of the same respiratory problems that tobacco smokers do, such as daily cough and phlegm production, more frequent acute chest illness, a heightened risk of lung infections, and a greater tendency to obstructed airways.
Cancer of the respiratory tract and lungs may also be promoted by marijuana smoke. A study comparing 173 cancer patients and 176 healthy individuals produced strong evidence that smoking marijuana increases the likelihood of developing cancer of the head or neck, and the more marijuana smoked the greater the increase. A statistical analysis of the data suggested that marijuana smoking doubled or tripled the risk of these cancers.
Marijuana use has the potential to promote cancer of the lungs and other parts of the respiratory tract because it contains irritants and carcinogens. In fact, marijuana smoke contains 50 to 70 percent more carcinogenic hydrocarbons than does tobacco smoke. It also produces high levels of an enzyme that converts certain hydrocarbons into their carcinogenic form—levels that may accelerate the changes that ultimately produce malignant cells. Marijuana users usually inhale more deeply and hold their breath longer than tobacco smokers do, which increases the lungs’ exposure to carcinogenic smoke. These facts suggest that, puff for puff, smoking marijuana may increase the risk of cancer more than smoking tobacco.
Other Health Effects
Some of marijuana's adverse health effects may occur because THC impairs the immune system’s ability to fight off infectious diseases and cancer. In laboratory experiments that exposed animal and human cells to THC or other marijuana ingredients, the normal disease-preventing reactions of many of the key types of immune cells were inhibited. In other studies, mice exposed to THC or related substances were more likely than unexposed mice to develop bacterial infections and tumors.
Effects of Heavy Marijuana Use on Learning and Social Behavior
Depression, anxiety, and personality disturbances are all associated with marijuana use. Research clearly demonstrates that marijuana use has potential to cause problems in daily life or make a person’s existing problems worse. Because marijuana compromises the ability to learn and remember information, the more a person uses marijuana the more he or she is likely to fall behind in accumulating intellectual, job, or social skills. Moreover, research has shown that marijuana’s adverse impact on memory and learning can last for days or weeks after the acute effects of the drug wear off.
Students who smoke marijuana get lower grades and are less likely to graduate from high school, compared to their non-smoking peers. In one study, researchers compared marijuana-smoking and non-smoking 12th-graders’ scores on standardized tests of verbal and mathematical skills. Although all of the students had scored equally well in 4th grade, the marijuana smokers’ scores were significantly lower in 12th grade.
A study of 129 college students found that, for heavy users of marijuana (those who smoked the drug at least 27 of the preceding 30 days), critical skills related to attention, memory, and learning were significantly impaired even after they had not used the drug for at least 24 hours. The heavy marijuana users in the study had more trouble sustaining and shifting their attention and in registering, organizing, and using information than did the study participants who had used marijuana no more than 3 of the previous 30 days. As a result, someone who smokes marijuana once daily may be functioning at a reduced intellectual level all of the time.
More recently, the same researchers showed that the ability of a group of long-term heavy marijuana users to recall words from a list remained impaired for a week after quitting, but returned to normal within 4 weeks. An implication of this finding is that some cognitive abilities may be restored in individuals who quit smoking marijuana, even after long-term heavy use.
Workers who smoke marijuana are more likely than their coworkers to have problems on the job. Several studies associate workers' marijuana smoking with increased absences, tardiness, accidents, workers' compensation claims, and job turnover. A study of municipal workers found that those who used marijuana on or off the job reported more "withdrawal behaviors"—such as leaving work without permission, daydreaming, spending work time on personal matters, and shirking tasks—that adversely affect productivity and morale.
Effects on Pregnancy
Research has shown that babies born to women who used marijuana during their pregnancies display altered responses to visual stimuli, increased tremulousness, and a high-pitched cry, which may indicate problems with neurological development. During infancy and preschool years, marijuana-exposed children have been observed to have more behavioral problems and poorer performance on tasks of visual perception, language comprehension, sustained attention, and memory. In school, these children are more likely to exhibit deficits in decision-making skills, memory, and the ability to remain attentive.
Addictive Potential
Long-term marijuana use can lead to addiction for some people; that is, they use the drug compulsively even though it often interferes with family, school, work, and recreational activities. Drug craving and withdrawal symptoms can make it hard for long-term marijuana smokers to stop using the drug. People trying to quit report irritability, sleeplessness, and anxiety(38). They also display increased aggression on psychological tests, peaking approximately one week after the last use of the drug(39).
Source:
http://www.marijuana-detox.com/m-dangers.htm
5th March 2007, 10:48 PM
6th March 2007, 1:35 AM
6th March 2007, 7:44 AM
6th March 2007, 9:19 AM
Okay, looks like I have some spare time before class after all, so let the games continue!
Haha, of course not, I was just being hyperbolic. I don't view people who abstain as "tightwads" (I'm sure they have more reasons than financial to abstain :p), just as people who have a different preference than me. I respect that choice.
Stupidity is the reason. There's no excuse for trying and continuing to something you know is terrible for your body. And, second-hand smoke always smelled great. And, I thought it'd be a good social function, me being new to college and everything. Also, I find it relaxing to take a few minutes off from whatever I'm doing to stand outside and puff on something. And *Ted Raimi voice* "Because it's coooooooooool!"
(that's a reference from "Battle of the Planets" of Zim fame)
Cannabis isn't proven to cause cancer. In fact, there was a slightly negative correlation of incidence of lung cancer when they compared those who smoke nothing and those who smoke only cannabis (and not cigarettes). It hasn't been proven to cause emphysema, either. However, cannabis smoke IS still irritating to the throat and can likely cause bronchitis. There are alternatives to smoking, of course - ingestion by cooking it by various means (brownies, cookies, tea, "cannabutter", hash oil, etc) and vaporization, mainly.
I sure do. :D
I figured some people's viewpoints would have at least softened. I won't hold those words against you, but it still felt good to type out. :)
Good to hear. I don't care whether another person smokes or not, but it's the condescension by those who don't smoke that pushes my buttons.
diplomacy++; //Sounds good
(sigh, only from a bloody Computer Science major)![[Image: doh.gif]](http://www.marijuana.com/420/images/smilies/doh.gif)
What makes those choices bad in the eyes of prohibitionists is misinformation about the substance in question. Of course, I ought to ask - are you another person in the boat that believes that cigarettes and alcohol should be illegal, too? Why is it a crime to alter one's perception, if he isn't harming anyone?
That's certainly your choice to make, but if pot were legalized, people wouldn't be walking down the street and smoking it (not ideally, anyway). There will still be public intoxication laws in place, and it would be similar to the fact that in many places, you aren't technically allowed to have alcohol out in the open.
IMO, people who casually use marijuana (let's say, once a week) simply aren't harming themselves. The harm from grass only comes from A) smoking it and irritating the throat, B) becoming addicted to it (don't forget that physical dependency is hardly present - it's less physically addictive than caffeine) and smoking it to the point where it interferes with one's social life, job, relationships, etc. How likely is this to happen? Well, an estimated 83 million people (37 percent) over the age of 12 have tried marijuana. If cannabis addiction were an epidemic, I think we'd know. ;)
Many sources try to make the claim that most people go to rehab for marijuana abuse, but the truth is, many people are SENT there by a judge as part of a plea bargain. The statistic of how many people is then abused, with prohibitionists claiming that people are mostly dependent upon cannabis. See how their propaganda works?
Many things can be considered "bad", given the proper context. Drinking too much water is bad. Rigorous exercise can cause a heart-attack. Here, let me give you an even better example:
(A) The number of physicians in the U.S. is 700,000
(B) Accidental deaths caused by Physicians per year are 120,000
© Accidental deaths per physician is 0.171.
Statistics courtesy of U.S. Dept of Health Human Services.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Now think about this:
(A) The number of gun owners in the U.S. is 80,000,000.
(Yes, that's 80 million..)
(B) The number of accidental gun deaths per year, all age groups, is 1,500.
© The number of accidental deaths per gun owner is .000188
Statistics courtesy of the FBI
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
So, statistically, doctors are approximately
9,000 times more dangerous than gun owners.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Remember, "Guns don't kill people, doctors do."
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
FACT: NOT EVERYONE HAS A GUN,
BUT ALMOST EVERYONE HAS AT LEAST ONE DOCTOR.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Please alert your friends to this alarming threat. We must ban doctors before this gets completely out of hand!!!!!
(that was taken from a chain-email from people who are anti-gun-control)
Once again, given the proper context, anything can be considered bad.
----------------
Etoven: I'm still planning to pick apart your post, but I have class in an hour and need some time for some last-minute preparations. However, I'll answer the part of your post that you actually wrote for now.
Hold on, there. I've driven while under the influence of cannabis, not "stoned off my ass". I may have been under some influence, but that's hardly a black-and-white issue. Same with alcohol: there's a blood alcohol content level which states use as a threshold to determine when a driver is too intoxicated.
I'm glad you were there to know how stupid I was being. Which night in particular are you talking about?
Please, PLEASE tell me you don't actually believe this. Where do you draw your knowledge from - Reefer Madness?
Ahahahahahahaha!! Hoo-boy, you've never smoked, have you? I can get a good buzz from cannabis going on without being rendered completely oblivious, thank you very much. I can't say the same about alcohol, unfortunately. I can smoke and have intelligent conversations, cook food, do homework (though I prefer to be sober, because I don't get distracted as easily, and feel like I retain information better) and... well, pretty much anything I can do while sober.
If this is your attitude towards cannabis (completely unfounded and inaccurate and based on myths that have been proven false decades ago), I won't even bother arguing with you. Next thing, you'll tell me that I'll sprout BREASTS because I smoke weed!
Not entirely clearheaded, no, but I'm nowhere NEAR as incapacitated as you're suggesting.
I'm assuming you meant "I don't need the personal...", as you've clearly had no experience with grass or grass-smokers whatsoever. Your delusional ideas of marijuana usage seem like they come directly from D.A.R.E.
On the contrary, you're relying on misinformation and propaganda from a source that makes its money offering drug rehabilitation.
Quote:I hardly "run screaming in the other direction". Is that how you view people who are clean of the stuff, as a bunch of tightwads who don't know how to have a good time? In fact, in the one occasion I have been offered the stuff, I simply politely declined. I will add that the person who offered it was also polite and respected that.
Haha, of course not, I was just being hyperbolic. I don't view people who abstain as "tightwads" (I'm sure they have more reasons than financial to abstain :p), just as people who have a different preference than me. I respect that choice.
Quote:I actually don't smoke nicotine either, and it's beyond me why anyone who grew up in the era where pictures of horribly blackened lungs were routinely given to children as birthday presents would actually want to take up that habbit.
Stupidity is the reason. There's no excuse for trying and continuing to something you know is terrible for your body. And, second-hand smoke always smelled great. And, I thought it'd be a good social function, me being new to college and everything. Also, I find it relaxing to take a few minutes off from whatever I'm doing to stand outside and puff on something. And *Ted Raimi voice* "Because it's coooooooooool!"
(that's a reference from "Battle of the Planets" of Zim fame)
Quote:I'm free to openly criticize your choice and say your "body policy" or whatever you call it is not very healthy. I mean it's still smoke we are talking about here. It can still cause lung cancer if nothing else, and it isn't nothing else, as it does cause memory issues.
Cannabis isn't proven to cause cancer. In fact, there was a slightly negative correlation of incidence of lung cancer when they compared those who smoke nothing and those who smoke only cannabis (and not cigarettes). It hasn't been proven to cause emphysema, either. However, cannabis smoke IS still irritating to the throat and can likely cause bronchitis. There are alternatives to smoking, of course - ingestion by cooking it by various means (brownies, cookies, tea, "cannabutter", hash oil, etc) and vaporization, mainly.
Quote:But, your choice. You won't die from it, and the smoke is actually less likely to kill you than tobacco, so hey, you've got that going for you.
I sure do. :D
Quote:Rest assured, Beanjo, that I will read your epic post in it's entirety when I have a day or so free.
However, I did read you responses to my post and, though I feel it unfair to use someones three-year-old words against them (pfft, what am I saying, in politics, that's nothing), I will say that my view on the use of marijuana has not changed much. I still have no desire to smoke it, nor will you change my mind, I'm afraid. I've no interest, so waste not your energy.
I figured some people's viewpoints would have at least softened. I won't hold those words against you, but it still felt good to type out. :)
Quote:That being said, what has changed is my viewpoint on those who do choose to partake. I do not feel these people are less than me, stupid, or anything of the like I may have felt those years ago. I've grown more tolerant of others in my wise old age, and if that is how you choose to enjoy yourself then by all means enjoy, my views on your hobby are irrelevant, as yours may be to mine.
Good to hear. I don't care whether another person smokes or not, but it's the condescension by those who don't smoke that pushes my buttons.
Quote:Let us agree to disagree, my friend. I still respect you as well .
diplomacy++; //Sounds good
(sigh, only from a bloody Computer Science major)
Quote:Intelligent people can make bad choices, certainly, but it doesn't make the choices any less bad.
What makes those choices bad in the eyes of prohibitionists is misinformation about the substance in question. Of course, I ought to ask - are you another person in the boat that believes that cigarettes and alcohol should be illegal, too? Why is it a crime to alter one's perception, if he isn't harming anyone?
Quote:As for the second paragraph... if it affects others (like secondhand cigarette smoke -- I should never have to smell that stuff and have it get in my system! Or even more obviously, drunk driving.) then it is wrong.
That's certainly your choice to make, but if pot were legalized, people wouldn't be walking down the street and smoking it (not ideally, anyway). There will still be public intoxication laws in place, and it would be similar to the fact that in many places, you aren't technically allowed to have alcohol out in the open.
Quote:If you're only hurting yourself it is a somewhat less clear picture, but I do think society has a responsibility to keep people from hurting themselves too much, and this includes efforts like trying to get people off of drugs, suicide prevention efforts, etc. These are good things.
IMO, people who casually use marijuana (let's say, once a week) simply aren't harming themselves. The harm from grass only comes from A) smoking it and irritating the throat, B) becoming addicted to it (don't forget that physical dependency is hardly present - it's less physically addictive than caffeine) and smoking it to the point where it interferes with one's social life, job, relationships, etc. How likely is this to happen? Well, an estimated 83 million people (37 percent) over the age of 12 have tried marijuana. If cannabis addiction were an epidemic, I think we'd know. ;)
Many sources try to make the claim that most people go to rehab for marijuana abuse, but the truth is, many people are SENT there by a judge as part of a plea bargain. The statistic of how many people is then abused, with prohibitionists claiming that people are mostly dependent upon cannabis. See how their propaganda works?
Quote:Yes, I know that marijuana 'isn't as bad' as harder drugs. This just isn't that relevant, really. Less bad is still bad!
Many things can be considered "bad", given the proper context. Drinking too much water is bad. Rigorous exercise can cause a heart-attack. Here, let me give you an even better example:
(A) The number of physicians in the U.S. is 700,000
(B) Accidental deaths caused by Physicians per year are 120,000
© Accidental deaths per physician is 0.171.
Statistics courtesy of U.S. Dept of Health Human Services.
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Now think about this:
(A) The number of gun owners in the U.S. is 80,000,000.
(Yes, that's 80 million..)
(B) The number of accidental gun deaths per year, all age groups, is 1,500.
© The number of accidental deaths per gun owner is .000188
Statistics courtesy of the FBI
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So, statistically, doctors are approximately
9,000 times more dangerous than gun owners.
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Remember, "Guns don't kill people, doctors do."
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
FACT: NOT EVERYONE HAS A GUN,
BUT ALMOST EVERYONE HAS AT LEAST ONE DOCTOR.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Please alert your friends to this alarming threat. We must ban doctors before this gets completely out of hand!!!!!
(that was taken from a chain-email from people who are anti-gun-control)
Once again, given the proper context, anything can be considered bad.
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Etoven: I'm still planning to pick apart your post, but I have class in an hour and need some time for some last-minute preparations. However, I'll answer the part of your post that you actually wrote for now.
Quote:Let me pose this question SJ....
You say you drove stoned off your ass with no insident while high on marijuana.
Hold on, there. I've driven while under the influence of cannabis, not "stoned off my ass". I may have been under some influence, but that's hardly a black-and-white issue. Same with alcohol: there's a blood alcohol content level which states use as a threshold to determine when a driver is too intoxicated.
Quote:How the hell do you know your drive was with out incident? You where stoned off your ass being stupid!
I'm glad you were there to know how stupid I was being. Which night in particular are you talking about?
Quote:You could have murdered fifty people and not realized it cause you where stoned off your ass.
Please, PLEASE tell me you don't actually believe this. Where do you draw your knowledge from - Reefer Madness?Quote:Not to mention that being stoned certainly does nothing for the reflexes, timing, coordination, reaction time all crucial to driving. No doubt you ran several red lights and almost caused numerous traffic accidents and didn't realize it.
Ahahahahahahaha!! Hoo-boy, you've never smoked, have you? I can get a good buzz from cannabis going on without being rendered completely oblivious, thank you very much. I can't say the same about alcohol, unfortunately. I can smoke and have intelligent conversations, cook food, do homework (though I prefer to be sober, because I don't get distracted as easily, and feel like I retain information better) and... well, pretty much anything I can do while sober.
Quote:You probably didn't hear anything about it or assume it was without incident, because there where enough clear headed drivers out that night to get the hell out of your way.
I'm staying the hell off the road when your pot head ass comes driving by!
If this is your attitude towards cannabis (completely unfounded and inaccurate and based on myths that have been proven false decades ago), I won't even bother arguing with you. Next thing, you'll tell me that I'll sprout BREASTS because I smoke weed!
Quote:You say you where clear headed while smoking pot.
Not entirely clearheaded, no, but I'm nowhere NEAR as incapacitated as you're suggesting.
Quote:But You where high as well Your senses where also imparted. I did need the personal experiences of person in a drug induced state, I will not and can not except that as evidence to the contrary.
I'm assuming you meant "I don't need the personal...", as you've clearly had no experience with grass or grass-smokers whatsoever. Your delusional ideas of marijuana usage seem like they come directly from D.A.R.E.
Quote:I choose to rely on empirical evidence, the facts of pot smoking are in abundance.
On the contrary, you're relying on misinformation and propaganda from a source that makes its money offering drug rehabilitation.
6th March 2007, 12:30 PM
![[Image: 200px-Winners_Dont_Use_Drugs.png]](http://content.answers.com/main/content/wp/en/thumb/d/d2/200px-Winners_Dont_Use_Drugs.png)
6th March 2007, 1:59 PM
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Quote:He dismissed the entire contents of the article I posted before even reading it. Apparently, the doctor who wrote it was a pothead, and so was every one of the scientists and statisticians listed as one of the 70-some sources.
Well, I guess I wasted an hour, then. Oh well. Some people have their head too far up their ass to realize the truth, but what can you do? The sad thing is, these people vote.
Was the doctor Lester Grinspoon, by any chance?
Quote: I spent almost an hour arguing with him last night about it, and nothing I said was right because 'I was deluded'.
Irony is great.Quote:And no, he's never come closer to pot than a TV screen.
Surprise, surprise.
Quote:I just can't reconcile alcohol being legal and marijuana not being legal. It's a horrible double-standard.
Amen, bruddah.
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