Tendo City

And my conclusion? As nice as a lot of the widely advertised features are, it lacks some extremely basic functionality.

By basic, I mean I can't even find a "browse files and folders" option. Anywhere. I literally am forced to first convert all my music INTO iTunes' proprietary internal music format and use it's own playlisting, and the only way to do this seems to be a drag and drop. This also means I can't export it's playlists to whatever media player I wish to.

Along those same lines, I expect in most modern media players for external devices to appear in a browsing window when I plug them in, such as my PSP. Even Windows Media Player does this (though the Zune player does not, I guess they "copied" iTunes' LACK of functionality, not a surprise considering it's, well, Zune). In other words, unless it's an iPod, I can't easily move music back and forth between a music device and my computer.

Basically, for all the media "management" options it has, and the various organizational features are well done I must make clear, they can't outweigh the lack of the most basic file management features imaginable. I honestly don't see how this has become such a popular tool when I can't even simply browse my directory structure from within the program or move my music into a portable system and back seamlessly in the same way. I had heard about all these amazing synching features, but I guess that's only if you own an Apple-made device like an iPod. In order to move things FROM my iTunes library, I can't even just browse to the folder. I've got to convert it out of that library format into something more open, and then use standard operating system methods to then copy that music back into it. The whole thing is just a mess, leading me to ask why I shouldn't just use, sigh, frickin' Media Player like I've been doing.

In fact, even Sony's Media Go seems more capable. At least it's library system doesn't require a preliminary conversion to a proprietary format and it recognizes my PSP (it may still exclusively recognize it, but it does it well and organizes files as actual files). I don't really WANT to use Media Go mind you, but it actually HAS these features.

Is this what "user friendly" now means, hiding the actual FILE STRUCTURE from the user, permanently, forcing them to learn MORE about the inner workings of the thing JUST to do something outside Apple's profitable parameters? I'm all for making the interface easy to use, but let's not simultaneously delete entire commands from the interface. It's about as annoying as Windows 7's "pseudo folders" that trick the user who doesn't do a little research into thinking that everything actually is physically located in those folders, instead of the reality, that they are spread around the disk (causing headaches more often than it should when it comes to file management).

If I've missed something and there are ways, easy ways, to do what I am trying to do with this program, please tell me so. So far, in looking this up online, I've found very convoluted guides that actually suggest I BURN A CD and then rip it back in Media Player as part of the process of getting something back out of the library. That's... idiotic.

It's like, I want to help you, and I probably even can, but I can't figure out precisely what you're unable to do here.

Browse my folders through a dialog box in iTunes, to do things like play MP3 files directly without going through this database nonsense. Or, on top of that, see my PSP's folders in the iTunes interface to synch things between my computer and my PSP. You know, basic file management stuff, with the actual file system.

Oh.

Yeah, I don't think you can do any of that. I'm not sure why you'd want to browse folders compared to simply searching the database, though. Browsing folders takes far longer than simply typing something in the database search bar.

I don't think it's possible to sync the PSP to anything but the Sony media manager, unless there's some third-party software for it.

I gave up on iTunes myself, because it's so badly bloated. I like the interface, but a computer as new as mine should not be bogged down by a mere media player.

The reason I want to do that is because it's more useful at times to do things that way. Sometimes you need to see the directory structure. Also, sometimes you don't WANT to add everything into the database. If it's a universal solution to media playback, it should have basic directory structure tools, and a method to view it that way.

I also don't like waiting for searches if I know where a file is immediately.

As for the PSP, I can accept the lack of automated syncing, but that's just another reason why basic file system management should be available. In the event of a lack of support for any particular device, I should be able to manually drag and drop music into any folder I wish on a portable device.

All that said, I've messed with the Zune player from Microsoft as well. It's actually less useful than iTunes in this regard. In fact, it's interface is about as obtuse and hard to figure out as it can possibly be.

Essentially the only feature they'd need to add is a generic "open" button, and the ability to add directories directly to the left-hand "playlists" for direct browsing and manipulation of files. As it stands, for the purposes I need it for, Windows Explorer does a better job than iTunes.

I added my entire music collection into iTunes, so I'm never faced with the need to search directories, and it makes searches instantaneous.

I let iTunes make its own directories anyway, because you can drag files right from the iTunes interface directly and drop them anywhere.

Don't like iTunes restrictions? Then use a better music player, like ... well, just about anything...

Well what I was really hoping for was a solution to my question, but I guess that such basic things are missing in iTunes?

Weltall, I should make this clear. If it's JUST a matter of my entire database, on my one computer, all being organized, I might be fine with leaving iTunes to manage it, however it's more complex than that. External devices, unless they are an iPod, can't be synced. There's no apparent way to set it up even. I'm not buying an iPod just to use iTunes with it, so I'm at an impasse with this program. I'm literally forced to use something outside the program just to move my music back and forth between my PC and my PSP. That's silly. Media Go, Sony's own attempt at competing with iTunes, is one way I can sync stuff. However, that's a bit much. In the end, Media Player actually does it better, and that's a shame because it's not like Media Player is all that good. However, it detects any portable device I hook up to it, I can set up syncing, and I can browse by folders as well as playlists. I'm not asking for the moon here Apple, just some danged basic file management features.

iTunes is a store and music player for iPod users, pretty much. Expecting it to be anything more is like expecting Apple to design programs that aren't extremely limited and controlling -- that is, it's probably not going to happen.

... I still just use Winamp for playing music on my PC...

You use your PSP as an actual digital music player?

I mean, I played an MP3 or two on mine. It was cute that it had the capability. That was all.

I really suggest getting a real player.

That's too expensive. All I need my PSP to do is play my music files back and support playlists and other things like randomize and "repeat all". It does all that. I'm sure a dedicated device like the iPod would be better, but I'm not about to fork out a bunch of money for that considering my PSP does what I need. For some having a dedicted device for every little thing is preferable, like getting an iPADD for reading or something.

I did have a dedicated MP3 player once upon a time, but it sucked as it stored about 14 songs and ran off a single AAA battery (plus the interface was pretty aweful and relied on a piece of proprietary software as it wasn't recognized as a storage device by operating systems). The biggest drawback on using the PSP is simply the size of the system, but I'm fine with that. I don't really find myself going places where I want to listen to music on the go anyway, it's usually limited situations like waiting rooms or staying in a hotel room or being a passenger on a ride. I don't walk around outside while listening to music, as generally I like to actually hear the world around me if I'm in motion.

At any rate, this isn't really what I'd call a way to solve the problem. What it comes right down to is, iTunes doesn't do what I want, Windows Media Player actually performs the job better, so I'm ditching it. That's all.

PS, you raised in an Indian tech support farm? Their modus operandi tends to be exactly that, tell someone with a small problem that all their hardware needs to be replaced with very expensive alternatives. "How do I change my display resolution?" "Buy a new monitor."

I wasn't, but it blows my mind how Tendo City seems to attract people who are technologically-savvy, and yet use that technology in ways that, to me, seem strikingly less than optimal. My experience with the PSP is that it's basically a useless piece of crap until you install custom firmware and load it up with emulators and ROMs. To each his own, though, I guess. I have no fewer than five devices which I can utilize as an MP3 player, including my cell phone and two iPods. I'd have to be pretty desperate to resort to the PSP for that particular activity.

Also, what is your definition of 'expensive'? There are dozens of MP3 players under $100 that are spacious and well-designed. Hell, that second iPod I mentioned? It's a 1GB Shuffle. I'd give it to you for free, just so you could have a real one.

I'm just not really wanting to bother buying one. Besides, if it's not an iPod, it won't sync anyway so there's no point. I'm sure that under $100 is cheap for an iPod, but it's still a waste of money to me. As I said, my PSP works just fine for my needs, so I have no need to upgrade. I mean I just hook it up and hit "play" and I'm good to go. I really don't need anything else. All I've been trying to do is see what sort of software solutions to syncing I can come up with.

Oh, and my cell phone is bottom of the barrel dirt cheap. It doesn't play MP3s, or anything else really, except be a phone. That's all I want from it as well. I'm not paying hundreds of dollars for a "smart phone". Smart phone, idiot consumer. I am tech savvy, but I'm also frugal. I only buy things that I think I can actually get some real use out of. There's a reason I disabled text messaging on my phone, and that reason is there's this faster method of communication built right in, using my ACTUAL VOICE! It's amazing. Seriously, at some point some phone company is going to add "new Morse code communication!"...

I'm going to pay $150 for a Droid in six months and never use it as a phone. How cool is that?