Microsoft is rumoured to cut the price of its premium Xbox360 down to $299 - including a HD-DVD disc drive, as DigiTimes reports:
Microsoft, to prepare for the price cut, has negotiated reduced production costs for the Xbox 360 with Taiwan-based manufacturing partners, stated the sources. The manufacturers estimate that the total production cost can be reduced by 15-20% due to diminishing costs for most components along with increasing production scales and decreasing defect rates, the sources pointed out.
This rumour comes alongisde speculation that Microsoft has secured an exlusivity deal with Capcom regarding Resident Evil 5, as Games Industry reports:
Industry chatter at the Tokyo event claimed Resident Evil's no-show is owing to Microsoft tying up a shock exclusivity deal for 360, with an announcement due at the US firm's X06 event in Barcelona next week.
Speaking exclusively to GamesIndustry.biz at TGS 2006, Xbox boss Sensui refused to pour cold water on the rumour when questioned, stating that it had already been announced for Xbox 360 and adding, somewhat enigmatically: "All I can say is we are very good friends with Mr Inafune [the game's producer]".
If true, this would significantly up Microsoft´s chances in Europe and the US. I am more sceptical about Japan, since the console has been sitting on store shelves even at the ridiculously low price of $250, I believe. In the US and Europe, though, a $299 price tag for the premium version including an HD-DVD drive would spell huge trouble for both Sony and Nintendo. If anything is announced at X06 starting tomorrow, you will read about it here. I am attending the event.
Sources: DigiTimes, Games Industry
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From Kotaku:
Resident Evil 5 Not 360 Exclusive, Says Capcom
So are Mr. Inafune, producer of the Resident Evil games, and Microsoft Bee Effs Effs forever and ever and ever forever? Japanese Xbox boss Takashi Sensui says yes. What does Capcom say? Get your hand of my shoulder, you weirdo!
Specifically, extrapolations from Takashi Sensui's claims of friendship with Capcom should not be taken to mean Resident Evil 5 will be a 360 exclusive like Dead Rising and Lost Planet:
"Resident Evil 5 will release on PS3 and Xbox 360 as announced. There a no plans for an exclusive with the game", a spokesperson from the company told us.
Wishful thinking on Microsoft's part, apparently. Florian Eckhardt
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MS might be tryin to get exclusive rights to RE5 but I sincerely doubt Capcom would allow it, reason being that RE5 is their HD sequel to RE4 and are expecting huge sells in all regions, including Japan. Exclusivity to 360 means zero market in Japan, so I dont see that happening. In their mind they might be seeing RE5 on PS3 grabbing millions of Japanese while RE5 on 360 grabs millions of Americans. And somewhere in the mix is Umbrella Chronicles which should do well in all regions and uses an updated RE4 engine to take advantage of the Wii's extra power. We should end up with screenshots that look nearly identicle though one game will be in HD and the other will not.
Ultimately it's going to depend on how good these games are. If Umbrella Chronicles is a cheap thrown together experiment for Wii it will fail atleast in the states where people still have RE4 on the brain. If RE5 is a hastily thrown together sequel, well, as long as it's as good as RE4 then it wont have a problem grabbing market. But this is Capcom, they're not idiots. I think they're looking at their production costs, very little to Wii, the most to PS3 and wondering who should get their most time and money.
It's no secret that Sony is trying to bombard developers with the idea that if you want to make games for PS3 you will most likely not have the time or money to develop on other consoles. Capcom is fighting that ideal but, I think, only long enough to find out who they should commit to.
So, we approach launch for Wii and PS3. In all honesty the PS3 isn't actually launching. If anyone here is planning on getting one at launch you probably will not get it. 400,000 systems will be picked up by the demographic of rich kids which I believe is exactly that number. So MS is looking at Wii, low price, hugely popular, already a household name, and seeing the possibility of 360 losing share. Of course sales of 360 are almost halted right now and since launch have sold about 5 million systems which is below average. So now here comes Nintendo who promises to grab not only the gaming audience who haven't snagged a 360 yet but also entirely new demographics that MS couldn't touch. Answer: XBox 360 HD gaming, graphics on par with PS3, capable of better looking graphics than Wii for 300 bucks and oh btw includes the ability to play HD-DVD disks. That move would make Nintendo look plain stupid and PS3 would be a laughing stock above and beyond its current problems.
Of course the downside is that MS is already losing hundreds of dollars on 360 with each sale. Now they're going to eat another hundred dollars plus the cost of the HD-DVD add-on? Well, if you're already losing money why not lose more money if it gaurantees better market penetration and higher installed bases and then catch up to hardware costs and profit from software?
Its all rumor, but it's something MS is thinking about for sure.
I don't see it happening. I don't think Microsoft is taking Nintendo seriously as a threat to its marketshare, and the 360 will already have the edge as far as pricing goes. If they drop the Premium by a hundred and package a periph that costs another hundred, they'll be drowning in red ink, and probably without reason.
I can see such a bundle coming in two or three years, but not now.
Even low-end HD-DVD drives are $500 right now. I just don't see how they could sell the Xbox360 premium [a console they're probably losing money on at $400, and even with reductions in production costs they'll likely lose money at $300] with a free $500 HD player.
The add-on wouldn't be $500. Most of what makes an HD-DVD player $500 is already inside of the 360.
If this is true I will be getting a 360 a lot sooner than I thought. I really doubt it, though, since MS already has a decent price advantage over Sony, and I don't think they are worried about the Wii.
$300 with HD-DVD? Yeah, very doubtful... I know MS has lots of money, but weren't they trying to NOT lose as much this time? :)
$400 minimum if they did bundle, and almost certainly more than that.
MS isn't worried about Nintendo? I guess you could say Sony isn't worried about Nintendo either, afterall it's not like the PSP is failing to gain marketshare because of a competitor; nur nur nur. Why would a company that produces hardware with close relations to game development studios worry about a competing system for the same market from a company who also produces hardware, in house game development and close relations to other game studios? Again; nur nur nur.
You guys aren't dumb, but how on earth could you believe that a company isn't going to view any entry in to the same market that its in as a competitor, especially something as hyped and talked about as Wii from a company as well known as Nintendo?
As of right now, in terms of numbers, you could say that Sony doesn't consider anything a competitor in the home console arena. GC and XBox and XBox 360 barely taking 20% of the PS2's pie, comparing hundreds of millions installed users to a couple million clearly puts PS2 on top. But if you believe that Sony isn't fighting to claim that last 20% and fiercly compete with MS and Nintendo in order to do so you're mistaken. As we approach this next gen everyone's eyes, consumer and company alike are on Nintendo. No one knows who's going to claim victory in the market when all 3 consoles finally hit the fray.
This is simple logic, if you sell lemonade and someone opens a lemonade stand a block away you have a competitor and your sales average is at risk. When friday hits and you go the movies and you see 4 new films released that day they are all competing with eachother, all heavily advertized begging for your 12 dollars and free time. Some of the films will be multi-billion dollar blockbuster Hollywood tour de force flicks and some may be low budget independents starring people you never heard of and they are in fierce competition - There's many times that a small independent trumped a multi-million dollar blockbuster and the studios know this, so they treat every film that is still running its release or releasing that day as a threat to its sales.
Look at the portable MP3 player market. Who'd have to be an idiot to go in to that market with anything other than a 30 dollar disposable mp3 player. If you ask 200 bucks for your mp3 player it will be removed off the shelves of walmart to make room for more ipod merchandise before you get back your envoice. But companies who made high-end mp3 players before ipod's introduction and already have the factories and divisions of substructures within the company to handle the products still release them in to the cornered ipod market just because they want to grab that 1 or 2% share away from ipod. And ipod, like a fat king worried that not everyone in his kingdom loves him will increase advertizing, offer special deals, release newer products, etc, anything to gain that 1 or 2% back so that the end of the fiscal year has a bar that goes straight across or up and never, ever down. Even if it's by a percentage of a percentage.
Quote:The add-on wouldn't be $500. Most of what makes an HD-DVD player $500 is already inside of the 360.
Of course not, but you're still adding advance machinery to a machine that's already quite advanced. Now, they're going to lower the price of premium to $300 sometime soon, but probably not with a HD-DVD included.
ABF/ I agree. Though I could see a 300 package without the HD-DVD or HDD add-on.
$199 for the HD-DVD addon drive, no sign of a bundle yet.
http://ve3d.ign.com/articles/735/735714p1.html
X06 announcements so far:
-$199/199 Euros/129 Pounds for the HD-DVD drive
-BioShock PC/X360 exclusive
-PGR4
-next Splinter Cell game (after the upcoming one) will be console-exclusive on X360 (thus X360 and PC?)
-Halo Wars - X360-exclusive Halo-universe RTS from Ensemble Studios (Age of Empires)
-"exclusive" downloadable content for GTAIV
-a new Banjo-Kazooie game for X360
-Doom and Sensible Soccer for Live Arcade
Quote:# A landmark partnership announced between Academy Award-winning writer, director and producer Peter Jackson, Academy Award-winning screenwriter Fran Walsh, and Microsoft Game Studios will create two new interactive entertainment series exclusively for Xbox 360 and Xbox Live. The first series will be a collaborative effort with Bungie Studios to co-create the next great chapter in the "Halo" universe. The second series will be an entirely original property targeted at bringing new audiences into the captivating world of interactive entertainment. In addition, Microsoft Game Studios will partner with Jackson and Walsh to establish Wingnut Interactive, a studio dedicated to the creation of world-class interactive entertainment.
In utter defience of EMPIRICAL EVIDENCE, Sony is stating matter of factly that the PSP is selling better than the DS.
Quote:In utter defience of EMPIRICAL EVIDENCE, Sony is stating matter of factly that the PSP is selling better than the DS.
They twisted the available numbers and used an odd time-scale to make their statement "true", but that doesn't mean that it was TRUE. If that makes any sense.
Quote:They twisted the available numbers and used an odd time-scale to make their statement "true", but that doesn't mean that it was TRUE. If that makes any sense.
Yeah, they weren't lying. They were talking only about American sales, and restricted the sales period to not count all DSes sold before the PSP came out and to not include most of the bump from the DS Lite... :)
It is true though that the PSP isn't getting blown away here like it is in Japan. It's only losing by like 5.8 million to 5 million... though the DS'es lead is growing quickly now that the Lite has done well. Nowhere near as well as Japan (in the US it's like 250,000 a month, in Japan like 150,000 a week...), but well.
I hadn't read the twisting part, but yeah now that is an accurate, though meaningless, statement for them to make. Sort of like "We sold more in the past year than they did for exactly 5 minutes if you only count one version of their product and all versions of ours!". True, but misleading, which was their goal. It's TRUTHINESS BABY!
lazyfatbum Wrote:MS isn't worried about Nintendo? I guess you could say Sony isn't worried about Nintendo either, afterall it's not like the PSP is failing to gain marketshare because of a competitor; nur nur nur. Why would a company that produces hardware with close relations to game development studios worry about a competing system for the same market from a company who also produces hardware, in house game development and close relations to other game studios? Again; nur nur nur.
You guys aren't dumb, but how on earth could you believe that a company isn't going to view any entry in to the same market that its in as a competitor, especially something as hyped and talked about as Wii from a company as well known as Nintendo?
That's
not what I said. What I said was that Microsoft didn't view Nintendo as a
serious threat. Yes, Microsoft would love to usurp every ounce of Nintendo's marketshare. Every one of them would love to be 100%, but there comes a point where gaining that marketshare involves too much risk to show a reward. There are die-hard Nintendo fans that will never abandon Nintendo. Microsoft and Sony might well convince these people to purchase their machine in addition to the Wii, but neither company has any real chance of persuading those people to purchase
only their machine.
But I do not think either Microsoft or Sony views Nintendo as a legitimate threat to reclaim a majority of the market. I do not think such belief is wise, but there's ten years of precedent behind it. Nintendo
hasn't been a serious contender for the top spot since we were all in middle school. They might well be again, and I know we all hope they are, but I'll believe it when I see results, and I'm sure that's how the other two companies are thinking as well. Certainly Sony's behavior shows contempt for their competition; they think PS3 will dominate the world no matter how many blunders and stupid business decisions are made. Whether or not such thinking is unwise is easily debatable, what isn't is that Sony does behave that way.
On top of all of that, the last generation showed that market percentage doesn't guarantee profit.
Quote:It is true though that the PSP isn't getting blown away here like it is in Japan. It's only losing by like 5.8 million to 5 million... though the DS'es lead is growing quickly now that the Lite has done well. Nowhere near as well as Japan (in the US it's like 250,000 a month, in Japan like 150,000 a week...), but well.
They also don't even mention sales of the GBA, which have been higher than the DS and the PSP.
Quote:They also don't even mention sales of the GBA, which have been higher than the DS and the PSP.
GBA doesn't count, it's last gen... :)
GBA should start fading out now though. Not because it's old (closing in on two years since the DS came out), but because its game list is getting pretty thin... there are a few more major games (Metal Slug 1, Sonic 1, Final Fantasy V, Final Fantasy VI... seeing any trends here? ... a few original ones. The only one I truly want is Yggdra Union though.), but I don't know of any more upcoming first-party GBA titles, with recently released Pokemon Mystery Dungeon: Red Rescue Team being the last one, and that's a major breaking point if it's true that there will be no more first party GBA releases.
Now I get what you meant rtan. I still disagree, simply because more people are talking about Wii than PS3 or 360 and the system isn't even available yet. Wii is in men's magazines, hobby magazines, it's on CNN, there's message boards of aspiring painters who are angry that Bob Ross wasn't shown at E3. It's just gigantic Ubisoft said they haven't gotten so many emails about a game in over a decade, and now Red Steel is their top priority and increased its budget 3 times over. Meanwhile devs are jumping ship from PS3, canceling games and re-evaluating Nintendo since just as you said, we have two generations where Nintendo failed to claim the holy grail of consoles and they why of that means nothing to the developers, they just want to be friends with whoever generates the most appeal and user base. Right now, everyone wants to be friends with Nintendo, even contracted second parties to MS and Sony praise Wii and wish they could develop on it.
But really, Nintendo died. They died some time around two years ago and no one noticed. Nintendo went to heaven and pondered why it had died; lack of marketability or appeal to the the drones of GTA-needy angry kids or just people who only picked it up because 'you a gangsta a'ight'. Nintendo looked at its business model of 'fuck all third parties, we're goin it alone' and how the system with the most third party support gained interest simply because of more titles available. So Nintendo clipped its wings and came back down to earth, restructured its business models (apologized to third parties and negotiated support) and spent its fortunes on learning about the ins and outs of marketability (they bought a book) and cheese's rice Nintendo is reborn. The kiddy image replaced with business women, interacial couples and the elderly, BDSM punk 11 year old girls from france, and even the stubborn video game hating father.
The amount of hype generated for Wii makes MS and Sony very, very nervous. The top ten in Japan for over a year now has been dominated by DS, many times actually being all ten DS titles. You may not realize it, but Nintendo is already winning. It's already back on the minds of gamers and newcomers alike. It's not that company that failed last generation, it's oh hey, Nintendo's back. And slowly the gangsta rappas and MTV watching non-gameplayers, and grandma and grandpa and Bobby and Valery and by God even the people who defended the Playstation name all focus their attention on this new thing. This thing that looks like a toaster and just might become as common as one, without the need of a heavy price tag or expensive display equipment. Hell you can even do all the things people normally would have to buy a PC for.
You can think it, but you'd missing a big picture. MS knows it's not doing well in other regions and in America it's still distant second to PS2 and have plateued in sales. Sony may put a good front but believe me, they understand the negative press and reactions alot more intimately then you think. And the little toaster just sits, in a warehouse waiting to go on a truck, gaining positive praise just for the idea that it exists.
Yeah, but GBA I think will have the PS1's "lingering power" for about a year more now I think. I recall the PS1 had a lot of small game releases for a good few years after the PS2 was released, with the last one I recall being Final Fantasy Origins (1+2, the predecessor to Dawn of Souls on GBA).
After the massive overhaul of FF3, the rereleases of 5 and 6 just don't seem as interesting any more :D. I still hope they include the original Famicom version of FF3 on that cart... but as the Sierra thread should indicate, it's rare that a company pays attention to such things. Still, a full on remake is more than SOME companies are willing to do...
Without question, the Wii has generated extraordinary amounts of early praise from just about everyone, and it is piquing the interest of a lot of people who in years past would never admit to caring half a damn about Nintendo. The Wii might well be the most intriguing concept out there right now.
However, this was also the case with the Dreamcast seven years ago, remember? Sega was being reborn after years of poor business decisions dragged that name through the mud in the eyes of everyone who wasn't a die-hard Sega fan. With a powerful machine, a strong line-up of games and damn near unlimited potential thanks to the Dreamcast being the bulwark of the online console gaming revolution, the world seemed Sega's oyster in 1999, even moreso after the PS2 stumbled out of the gates with problematic hardware and a collection of titles that were, charitably, less than stellar.
Yet, the Dreamcast lasted an entire three months against the PS2. The interest of the general gamer collapsed once Sony harnessed the power of brand-name recognition. It wasn't even a fight.
The behavior of Sony in particular leads me to believe that the company thinks that will happen again, that the upstart Nintendo will wither in the face of the ultra-powerful PS3. In the console market, Sony has gone head-to-head twice and has come away the decisive winner in regards to market share and consumer awareness. They have also defeated Microsoft, the most powerful company in America, almost as decisively. They have lost overall percentage, but they know that was due mostly to an expanding market and an extra competitor. In strict numbers, the PS2 has been the most successful console ever concieved.
One looks at Sony, even those who are die-hard Sony fanboys, and all get the impression that Sony has decided to rest upon its laurels. We see a company who has dominated for so long that they are convinced that defeat is impossible. Their track record for a long time has suggested that it may be so. Even the PSP's lagging sales may be abberant in that regard. The PlayStation came along at a crossroads in the console market, and succeeded primarily because the top dog, Nintendo, made several critical errors in the conception and promotion of the Nintendo 64. The PlayStation went on to be what was at the time the most successful console ever, but honestly, it was an achievement that was in many ways gift-wrapped by Nintendo's failure to read the handwriting on the wall.
In essence, the roles may be reversing. Sony is now the colossus that sits convinced of its impervious position. Can Nintendo topple them? The tools are definitely there, and the situation seems very favorable. So far Nintendo has done practically everything right. The question is, can they keep it up when it really counts? Can they take this fantastically innovative concept and make it into the standard?
If anyone can do it, Nintendo can, but at the moment, I don't think Sony agrees. I have to say though, this is one former Sony fanboy that would absolutely love to see Sony take one in the kidneys.
Quote:Yeah, but GBA I think will have the PS1's "lingering power" for about a year more now I think. I recall the PS1 had a lot of small game releases for a good few years after the PS2 was released, with the last one I recall being Final Fantasy Origins (1+2, the predecessor to Dawn of Souls on GBA).
The DS will be two years old in a few months, you know... while successful consoles do often continue through their successors' lifespans (PS1 until 2003, SNES until early 1998 in the US and 1999 in Japan, NES until 1994, etc...), they don't go on forever. Perhaps another year, but Nintendo doesn't have any more announced games... there are a lot of upcoming releases, but they're almost all liscenced kid's games.
Quote:After the massive overhaul of FF3, the rereleases of 5 and 6 just don't seem as interesting any more . I still hope they include the original Famicom version of FF3 on that cart... but as the Sierra thread should indicate, it's rare that a company pays attention to such things. Still, a full on remake is more than SOME companies are willing to do...
They'd never do that for the US version... translate the Japanese FF3 rom just to make the ten people who actually want a translated NES FF3 rom and don't want to just download it happy? Yeah right.
ryan/ I didn't think about the DC launch, that's a good point. But there's a big factor to be considered and that's PSX on a huge high with th announced PS2 that had nothing but positive praise. The launch games sucked, but it's Sony's next system! It must be good, etc. The DC was out there, in a market of burned players. Unlike N64 and GC the SS and DC didn't have a huge hardcore following (though the DC does now which is funny). On N64 there were games that sold 8 million copies (guess) and GC had million sellers with almost every first party game. Sega never got that luxury, everyone was still pissed about the Sega CD, 32X and Saturn that fumbled and failed in front of them. Everyone took a wait and see approach with DC, but Sega couldn't muster the wait.
Looking at now, the big factor that seperates the DC launch from Wii's launch is that there is practically nothing positive about the PS3. it's HD, I cant wait to see Silent Hill on it but more than likely it will look just as good as 360, in fact the SH team offered a word about possible multi-console releases for future SH's. It's price, it's ridiculous claims of 30 million dollar production budgets and the lackluster 'ps2 with better graphics' are convincing people to stray away from it. On top of that, the launch titles so far are not gaining momentum but in fact lose interest with every new screenshot that's released, totally unlike the PS2's prelaunch. I read that at the show, many of the games were running at 20 frames a second, so while the racing games looked fantastically HD photoreal, they had a frame rate of poop and were less than great. On top of that you have weird shortages, a launch with 400 thousand systems for the entire united states compared to Nintendo's 4 million. Online stores that put preorders for wii are closing down the preorders within 24 hours because of demand and gamestop is rumored to have recieved so many calls and questions about preordering, that they will only accept preorders for one day on November 9th. The DC had no such luck, preorders were plnetiful and the system barely sold at launch.
With sony in such an awkward situation are experiencing Newton's law first hand. Talking about PS2, in japan and even here the top ten lists read like DS release schedules with one or two PS2 games. You know that scares Sony and MS, in fact the DS has almost caught up to installed bases that the PS2 have in about a quarter of the time, and you know that scares them too. Sony may want to view the upcoming launch as a repeat of DC's, but the factors are just too different. The DC wasn't the talk of the town like Wii nor did it generate as much interest or positive praise, the PS3 is being considered a joke unlike how the PS2 was then the end-all must-have console. Those two major factors, i'm willing to bet anyway, are on the minds of sony, and i'm willing to bet that they see Wii as a serious threat.
If all goes as planned, the Wii will outsell the DC in preorders alone and at the very most the PS3 wont be able to sell as many Wii's until a year after it's launch. The only thing that could kill Nintendo's plan is if the Wii doesn't sell at launch, or there's huge hardware problems and recalls. I dont see any of those happening come november.
Actually, the Dreamcast had broken launch sales records and I think it high one of the highest attach rates as well. It took a sharp nose dive afterwards though.
It was killed by the PS2 hype-train.
The launch in Florida atleast was extremely lowkey. The EB's and Babbages, etc had overstocked DC's and were selling them with unofficial bundles.
DC was pretty much dead within six months... another six months and the PS2 came out, and in under six months more Sega had given up; some more games did come out over the final six months of its life, but it really never had a chance... but yeah, right at launch it did actually do well. It just dropped off fast.
Quote:With sony in such an awkward situation are experiencing Newton's law first hand. Talking about PS2, in japan and even here the top ten lists read like DS release schedules with one or two PS2 games. You know that scares Sony and MS, in fact the DS has almost caught up to installed bases that the PS2 have in about a quarter of the time, and you know that scares them too. Sony may want to view the upcoming launch as a repeat of DC's, but the factors are just too different. The DC wasn't the talk of the town like Wii nor did it generate as much interest or positive praise, the PS3 is being considered a joke unlike how the PS2 was then the end-all must-have console. Those two major factors, i'm willing to bet anyway, are on the minds of sony, and i'm willing to bet that they see Wii as a serious threat.
I don't think casual gamers have heard about all of the complaints the hardcore have about Sony, though... they see "Playstation" and think it means gaming, really. Perhaps Nintendo can change that, and the price on the PS3's box will deter some, but it'll be a lot harder than you suggest.
The PS3 does have one thing going for it: really nice graphics. Well, two... it's also got at least a minimum of gauranteed support from the major Japanese third parties, which to many people means a lot... the "it might be a three-way split" people might be the most correct, actually. All of the bad press and price issues of the PS3 will vanish in many people's minds once they see some of the games... Nintendo will have to do a good job of showing how gameplay is more important than graphics and how the Wiimote truly is a change worth paying attention to to get Sony out of the casual gamer market.
Of course, Nintendo doesn't really look like that's what it's going to try to do... they are instead going after longtime Nintendo fans, children, and nongamers primarially it seems; while they do say that they'd like to win (or they do now anyway), their game lineup is not the sort that's going to convince PS3 and X360 gamers to buy a Wii, I think -- "innovative controls" vs. awesome graphics? Too many gamers will choose the latter... so Nintendo needs to succeed in the nongamer/casual gamer market first, where people care less about graphics (else they'd have bought one of the other consoles...). They could do it. We'll see...