By using the screen warp glitch I was able to get all the weapons/items from all 8 dungeons with only 3 hearts (and zero instruments). I am currently unable to beat the game because to get into the egg you have to have the instruments, and I haven't found a way to warp into the egg yet. (I am sure it's possible because if you screen warp while in a cave, you find out that all the underground areas are connected, and if you swim from the fishing pond, you get to see LOTS of different cave screens in no apparent order. All I have to do is find the right way to warp into it.)
Anybody else acheived all the items in Link's Awakening with only 3 hearts?
-TheBiggah-
Are you ACTUALLY The Biggah? If so, what is my nick name in WC3?
I think he's the real TheBiggah.
I know now for a fact he's not ABF in disguise.
It says his name is TheBiggah. I don't think anyone would fake their identity on the internet. The internet is a place of morality and ethics.
Anyway, I used the screen warp when I found out about it just to mess around in the game. I never tried to get all the items since I was just kind of fooling around with the screen warp, but it was one of the most interesting bugs I've ever encountered in a game.
There have been many TheBiggah imposters, and considering his rather...incendiary relationship with some people here (for some reason, myself included), I'm a bit skeptical, as always, of this TheBiggah. If it IS really him, then perhaps the prospect of returning to an OB1-free TendoCity was at leats marginally appealing.
He's posted a few times, as his post count of 18 shows... I think it's him, but I guess it COULD be a really good impostor...
Anyway, LA is still probably the best handheld game ever. But I never tried that...
I've never tried that trick either. In fact, I haven't played LA in so long. I need to get back to it. (Maybe start a new file since it's been so long.)
I did beat it without dying, to see the special ending, though...
The special ending involves Marin with angel wings singing the Ballad of the Windfish, correct? I think I heard about that once, but I've never beaten the game, so I don't know.
I played with the screen warp a little, but never tried to acomplish anything with it. It is a very interesting bug, though.
Same here. The screen warp is really just a cute bug in the game, and I never really turned it into a challenge.
Here's one thing to consider. The egg may be in the main map, but what if it's seperated by a room of solid wall? How exactly do you screen warp when you can't even touch the edge?
Anyway, as some may know, the DX version fixed the screen warp glitch.
There's still one fun glitch, the "you can't progress in the game" glitch in the waterfall dungeon (or whatever that one was called). It's the one where there are all those glowing tiles you have to touch in order to get a key, only they are all in the water. So, you can't get to some of the tiles unless you swim. Or, that's how it's supposed to work. Using clever use of the feather and the pegasus boots and a lot of good spacing and "veering", you can actually do it early, get that key, and use it in a place you weren't supposed to, locking out access to things you need to beat that dungeon FOREVER. The simple way to fix that glitch would just be to program the tiles to not even function until you get the flippers. Sure it would kill the illusion that the world is truly "there" just a tad in that one instance, but it would keep people from screwing themselves over.
I have the DX version, so the screen warp wouldn't have worked for me anyway.
Dark Jaguar Wrote:Here's one thing to consider. The egg may be in the main map, but what if it's seperated by a room of solid wall? How exactly do you screen warp when you can't even touch the edge?
If you use the screen warp while leaving the fishing pond, the guy will be sitting in a tree... if you talk to him and agree to go fishing, you'll end up at a screwed up fishing pond that allows you to swim (so you'd already need the flippers) from screen to screen without having to continue to use the warp...you can swim through solid walls.
Quote:Anyway, as some may know, the DX version fixed the screen warp glitch.
It also made the game easier to beat with those stupid owl statues being more prevalent and obvious in their messages.
Quote:There's still one fun glitch, the "you can't progress in the game" glitch in the waterfall dungeon (or whatever that one was called).
Anglers Cavern.
Quote:It's the one where there are all those glowing tiles you have to touch in order to get a key, only they are all in the water. So, you can't get to some of the tiles unless you swim. Or, that's how it's supposed to work. Using clever use of the feather and the pegasus boots and a lot of good spacing and "veering", you can actually do it early, get that key, and use it in a place you weren't supposed to, locking out access to things you need to beat that dungeon FOREVER. The simple way to fix that glitch would just be to program the tiles to not even function until you get the flippers. Sure it would kill the illusion that the world is truly "there" just a tad in that one instance, but it would keep people from screwing themselves over.
While that may work, it's not the way I've done it. There is a jump that looks impossible where you need to jump from the right side of the screen around a corner and land on a switch to open the door. The jump can be made without the pegasus boots, just great timing. Then you use your last key on the block in the next room...and voila, unwinable game (the only one ever in a Zelda game from my understanding). You need the flippers to get the next key, and you need a key to get the flippers.
-TheBiggah-
I never got around to getting the DX version... didn't seem worth it, really. Anyway, the game was meant to be played in monochrome... and in the DX version the sprites aren't all red so you can't tell which statues will come alive and which won't. :D
Quote:While that may work, it's not the way I've done it. There is a jump that looks impossible where you need to jump from the right side of the screen around a corner and land on a switch to open the door. The jump can be made without the pegasus boots, just great timing. Then you use your last key on the block in the next room...and voila, unwinable game (the only one ever in a Zelda game from my understanding). You need the flippers to get the next key, and you need a key to get the flippers.
Ouch... what fun!
I don't see why someone would impersonate TheBiggah just to talk about Link's Awakening.
BTW that avatar brings back memories. I wonder what Dinosaur Planet would of been like without the StarFox theme.
I got the DX version shortly after it came out because I didn't have the original version. (I'm a kid compared to most of you.) I think I used a Game Boy Pocket to play the game way back when I first got it, so I couldn't tell the different Armoses apart anyway. I now use a Game Boy Color and a Game Boy Advance. (My GBP was stolen back in 8th grade.)
The Armos thing is a cheat, basically, since they're supposed to all look the same... :) I know that DX made the game easier in some ways and I'd consider that bad, for the most part, but I have to admit finding it fun to be able to get through that part so easily...
I really need to pick that game back up. I suppose I will when I'm through with Chrono Trigger, Final Fantasy IX, and Ocarina of Time. Oh yeah, I also started a new file on Super Mario RPG not too long ago, I need to finish that. I think I got up to Kero Sewers.
I've beaten LA five times... OoT? Beat it once (yup, just once... I got halfway through a second time, then my cart erased itsself, then I started over and got halfway again... but I haven't played in a while.). OoA/OoS? Once each (A first, S second, with the carryover). NES Zelda? Haven't finished it for GBA, I eventually quit at dungeon six... LttP I also haven't gotten around to finishing. I think last time I played I finally got around to getting that stupid spell I needed so I could continue the game (seriously, I don't miss the days of "we won't tell you what to do, you just need to figure out that you need to go to random semi-hidden location X at some point in order to progress!"), but I haven't gone back to finish that dungeon (in the dark world swamp) yet... and MM of course... well, I did play it a bit this summer, and got halfway through the Stone Tower, but I haven't done the Upside-Down Stone Tower yet (saved after doing the normal one). WW of course I beat... didn't bother with the second quest though, Link having to be in his lame normal clothes is really stupid and the game isn't really worth playing over anytime soon...
I've finished OoT numerous times and WW twice. Those are the only Zelda games I've finished. I stopped Zelda I a little after the first dungeon. Zelda II, I got a good ways... I think I was around the town of Saria when I stopped. The second dungeon or so. Or maybe the third. I got pretty far in both LA and MM, but I never beat either one. I've only played a tiny bit of Minish Cap, and I haven't played any of the others. Oh yeah, LTTP... I got stuck on the second dungeon.
I've played through LA about six times, and I still think LTTP is much, much easier. Once you get the red tunic, gold sword, and four bottles of blue potion, you're practically unstoppable. In LA, you get one dose of Magic Potion, and that's it.
LA is my second-favorite Zelda game after OoT, no question... such an awesome game...
The armos statues in the DX version DO all look the same. However, if you play the ORIGINAL version on a GBC then you can cheat because the enemy armos are on a different sprite layer than the plain statue armos. So, no they didn't make that easier. In fact, I took off to southern face shrine just to make sure, and while the game is colorized, they actually designed all the colorization themselves, so all the armos statues are the same stony grey. No way to tell even in DX, so just hold out your shield whenever you are near one...
I've checked it all out, the only place the game was made easier is in the hint statues. In the original, there are less statues and they all give the same cryptic hint. In DX, there are a few more and some of them give new hints, not at all in cryptic fasion. You can at least avoid those, but yes that will make the game easier to people playing for the first time, because it's those people who won't know which slabs to avoid...
Quote:The armos statues in the DX version DO all look the same. However, if you play the ORIGINAL version on a GBC then you can cheat because the enemy armos are on a different sprite layer than the plain statue armos. So, no they didn't make that easier. In fact, I took off to southern face shrine just to make sure, and while the game is colorized, they actually designed all the colorization themselves, so all the armos statues are the same stony grey. No way to tell even in DX, so just hold out your shield whenever you are near one...
I know, of course that's what they'd do... they added more hints, but I don't think they made the actual puzzles or enemies easier.
Quote:I've checked it all out, the only place the game was made easier is in the hint statues. In the original, there are less statues and they all give the same cryptic hint. In DX, there are a few more and some of them give new hints, not at all in cryptic fasion. You can at least avoid those, but yes that will make the game easier to people playing for the first time, because it's those people who won't know which slabs to avoid...
It was a hard game the first time. I died a lot and got stuck frequently... and the hints (the cryptic stones were a help for the one puzzle in the dungeon they referenced -- sometimes...) from calling on the phone helped some, but still, it was tough... they probably made it easier because getting stuck that much isn't as accepted now... of course, I don't like games that are utterly cryptic and expect you to randomly wander around some large area to figure out where to go, or have random hidden doors you have to find to progress, or whatnot. But there is a point where you make it too linear... and I think that original LA did it right -- quite hard but not impossible -- while DX eased up a bit too much.
The hint stones are a bit much.
And yes, what's wrong with being stuck in a game completely stumped as to how to progress? That's part of the fun! Yes, if the puzzle is so hard that the only way to solve it is in retrospect, and you have to "force" it by doing random stuff until something happens, then it's too tough, or just not very clever sometimes.
However, LA had about the perfect level of puzzle difficulty. I remember being stuck for days in the Face Shrine, and sure I got frustrated, but the puzzle WAS logical there and when I finally figured it all out, it was great! I also managed to get really stumped in the eagle tower and the flame dungeon, both found on the mountain.
However, as I already played LA, the extra hints really do nothing for me, so the DX version is the one I stick with. However, I will note that some sort of "easy" and "hard puzzle difficulty selection would have been welcome.
Quote:And yes, what's wrong with being stuck in a game completely stumped as to how to progress? That's part of the fun! Yes, if the puzzle is so hard that the only way to solve it is in retrospect, and you have to "force" it by doing random stuff until something happens, then it's too tough, or just not very clever sometimes.
When it's too random -- see the kind of stuff NES games like to pull -- it's bad. For instance, the heart containers in the overworld in Zelda 1. And 'extremely cryptic and not really helpful hints' aren't too good either... see the infamous Desert Palm Trees Puzzle in Final Fantasy Adventure... puzzles like that got you to give up on those games, or to go and read the strategy guide... they are gone now and I don't miss them much. :)
Quote:However, LA had about the perfect level of puzzle difficulty. I remember being stuck for days in the Face Shrine, and sure I got frustrated, but the puzzle WAS logical there and when I finally figured it all out, it was great! I also managed to get really stumped in the eagle tower and the flame dungeon, both found on the mountain.
Yes, LA got its difficulty right... high, but not so high as to be impossible... and with just enough clues to get you through. I remember that the first time the game took me three months to beat because of how I'd play a bit, get stuck, then stop again in frusteration, but oh well... and now that I've beaten it five times it seems easy (the puzzles I mean, it's still all too easy to die)...
Yeah, from what I remember of LA, it was just the right level of challenge. Not ridiculously easy nor impossibly hard.
Best Zelda Ever. End of Discussion.
here is a remix of The Face Shrine I did a few years back. Sorry about the production, it got messed up when I was making it into an mp3.
FACE SHRINE MIX!
Quote:Best Zelda Ever. End of Discussion.
Best 2d Zelda, you mean. :)
A Black Falcon Wrote:Best 2d Zelda, you mean. :)
Nope. Best Zelda.
I think Zelda should have stayed 2d. :D
Do we allow people who dislike OoT here?
We do, but they have to part ways with their skin.
*gets pruning shears*
That'll take more than the skin!
Weltall: Look, this isn't an exact science.
DJ: Um...
Weltall: Okay let me put it this way. This isn't exactly a science.... at all...
DJ: Well alright then.
Moving along, LA is still my favorite of the 2D Zelda games. I loved when the true nature of the island was revealed in southern Face Shrine, but also the rest of the game. Out of all the 2D Zelda games, I've beaten LA the most.
But, I do enjoy the 3D games as well.
The concept is that he has no skin. Whatever else is removed is just a bonus. :D
Quote:*gets pruning shears*
And the duct tape, don't forget the duct tape...
Quote:Moving along, LA is still my favorite of the 2D Zelda games. I loved when the true nature of the island was revealed in southern Face Shrine, but also the rest of the game. Out of all the 2D Zelda games, I've beaten LA the most.
But, I do enjoy the 3D games as well.
Agreed on both counts, of course. LttP is good and all, but I just don't like it as much as LA... (this is a safer statement without OB1 around... :))
Mr Write. You know it doesn't get better than that.
Who is he supposed to remind me of?! That comment in the instruction booklet is lost on me!
LA is definitely the best 2-D Zelda. WW is the best game to ever make 3-D mechanics feel as fluid as 2-D. While OoT is the better game overall, WW has the best mechanics. So OoT, MM and WW are all a matter of opinion over which is best in the 3-D arena. But for 2-D nothing beats LA. Though I haven't played Minish Cap yet :(
But yeah, I think WW is the best mechanics wise and MM is the best gameplay wise.
I expect that to change by early 2006. :D
Quote:Who is he supposed to remind me of?! That comment in the instruction booklet is lost on me!
The Mayor from SimCity-SNES, right? (not in the PC version)
Quote:LA is definitely the best 2-D Zelda. WW is the best game to ever make 3-D mechanics feel as fluid as 2-D. While OoT is the better game overall, WW has the best mechanics. So OoT, MM and WW are all a matter of opinion over which is best in the 3-D arena. But for 2-D nothing beats LA. Though I haven't played Minish Cap yet
But yeah, I think WW is the best mechanics wise and MM is the best gameplay wise.
MM and WW had potential to beat OoT, but didn't, even in the categories. Oh, graphically they're fantastic, and the gameplay at times is as good as OoT, but the flaws... MM's frusteration factor greatly hurts that game, and WW's easiness (as well as other, lesser, issues) similarly hurts... yes, the combat system is more involved, but it doesn't feel much more strategic or satisfying because of how the enemies are easier...
Oh yeah, and I hate that "press A to jump over the enemy and knock off their armor" thing. I never got used to it at all... stupid thing. I wish it's gone in the next one. :)
Quote:I expect that to change by early 2006.
I don't know, OoT is a very high standard... close, yes... but better? I'm not so sure... especially once you consider nostalgia as a factor.
Quote:Oh yeah, and I hate that "press A to jump over the enemy and knock off their armor" thing. I never got used to it at all... stupid thing. I wish it's gone in the next one.
Oh, that. Allow me to explain the context sensitive critical strikes in WW. It should be easier once you understand it. First of all, the times you can do the A button move are based on what the enemy is doing, not on where you are in your own attack combo. Second of all, you can't do it if you are blocking. So, you can't just hold out your shield and wait it out. Thirdly, you need good reflexes and/or anticipation skills.
Let's use a dark nut as an example. Those guys are "open" when they decide to attack you, and at no other time. It also has to be a decent size swing, none of the little "poking" stuff. So, what you do if you really want to train is just start dodging around the enemy in a close circle, with your shield dropped. Soon, the a button will flash and that's where your reflexes take over. The move is performed automatically from there. Just make sure you aren't in an "awkward" position, or you may go off in some weird direction and miss completely.
Anyway, that's all there is to it, to talk about it. It does take some practice to get it down though.
That was an interesting addition, but it felt just a tad tacked on. I think it could be expanded by allowing many different possible reactions to the enemy's attacks that can be changed up a little more dynamically.
lazy, Minish Cap is a good game. Really good, but it doesn't measure up to LA... The world is small, and the game is short, even for a Zelda game. Only 6 dungeons, including the last dungeon. At least you get two dungeons of Wind, so they added more than you might think is there from the story. I say it's short and the world is small even relative to other Zelda games, like LA. The saving grace is that the game is a fun ride while it lasts. The puzzles are too easy, though in a few cases I'm pretty sure the puzzle in question might have been hard if this was only my 3rd or so Zelda game instead of what it really was. The game IS loaded with mini-games, more so than in LA or LTTP.
I think you'll enjoy it, but don't expect too much.
Quote:Anyway, that's all there is to it, to talk about it. It does take some practice to get it down though.
Ganon killed me two or three times because you couldn't beat him without that stupid "A to knock off his armor" thing. That says something about how often I used it before that... I actually found it easier a lot of the time to circle around them, or hit them with the weapon normally, or something else, than look for that stupid thing to appear and hit that button just at the right time... but you couldn't beat Ganon any other way, and he was actually hard, so I died.
A friend was there when I beat the game, actually, and he agreed that I didn't really understand the system. And that was at the final boss... :)
Quote:lazy, Minish Cap is a good game. Really good, but it doesn't measure up to LA... The world is small, and the game is short, even for a Zelda game. Only 6 dungeons, including the last dungeon. At least you get two dungeons of Wind, so they added more than you might think is there from the story. I say it's short and the world is small even relative to other Zelda games, like LA. The saving grace is that the game is a fun ride while it lasts. The puzzles are too easy, though in a few cases I'm pretty sure the puzzle in question might have been hard if this was only my 3rd or so Zelda game instead of what it really was. The game IS loaded with mini-games, more so than in LA or LTTP.
I think you'll enjoy it, but don't expect too much.
Of course it's not as good, it's made by Capcom, like Four Swords, FSA, and Oracles... and while those were all good games, none were as good as the real Zelda games (LttP or newer). Oh, Oracles was great... I really liked those games. Good, long, quite challenging... but it was quite lacking in originality and wasn't quite as good as the real ones. I guess the question is, is Minish Cap better than Oracles? If so it'd be pretty good... FS/FSA are different of course, with their level-based, linear, multiplayer focus.
Anyway, I certainly plan on getting Minish Cap someday.
Oh, that difficulty thing about Minish Cap is too bad... Oracles was pretty challenging, so it's dissapointing to see the next real Zelda game from that time be easy (FS/FSA don't count...).
Dark Jaguar Wrote:Who is he supposed to remind me of?! That comment in the instruction booklet is lost on me!
I think he's suppose to be Will Wright, the creator of the SimCity series, etc. I guess he was included with LA to promote SimCity for SNES.
Anyway, I still say that LttP is the best Zelda game, 2D or 3D. I thought it was more difficult than OoT, and I had just as much fun exploring that world of LttP as I did exploring the 3D world in OoT. LA is great, and just as hard as LttP, but I thought LttP provided a larger world because of the seperate dark world, and there were more secrets to find in LttP. Anyway, I'd say LttP is the best Zelda game, followed closely by OoT and LA.
LttP vs LA's size... ... where was that thread where OB1 posted the map size comparisons to try to "end" that argument of ours... I know, LttP is physically larger, but to me it felt small because of the layout (center area with a ring of other areas around it) and the fact that the terrain features are so much bigger (LttP trees are four times larger than LA trees, for instance)...
Oh, and I still don't really like the LttP Link sprite.
Anyway, LA was clearly improved on LttP, I'd say... there is less of the extremely frusterating puzzles with minimal clues (like in LttP when you need to get some item halfway across the map to do something for the next dungeon but it doesn't really tell you what you need or where it is; LA isn't exactly completely clear all the time either by any means, but it's not quite as bad...), the dungeons all have halfway bosses with warps, greatly reducing the huge amount of frusteration LttP has from its very annoying dungeon design of "long linear path which you must follow every time"... makes beating the bosses quite a trial when you need to essentially play through the whole dungeon each time you die, trying this time to get through without being hit ever... yes, the minibosses with warps (and less straight-line path level designs) were good. Oh, the LA dungeons were quite hard, certainly, and the first time that game took me quite a while... but it didn't have as much of that challenge being because of how far it would send you back each time you die (without being able to quickly re-cover any of that ground most of the time). :)
LA also has a less cliche story, too... and also, LA advanced the control scheme. The two item system is a clear advance over LttP's system... as is only displaying the numbers of items for the ones you actually have equipped instead of always having the number of bombs, arrows, etc. on the screen. And the map is better too, with the lines actually showing where the screens are and the fact you can scroll around it and get descriptions of the places... a big advance there, for sure.
That brings up another thing, I really liked how in LA you could go up to items and get descriptions... like when Link walks up to a chest it says something. None of the other Zelda games do that, sadly...
Just out of curiosity, ABF, when did you play LttP for the first time. Was it when it was first released, or did you play it after more recent Zeldas. I ask because the story in LttP was different from previous Zelda games. The dark world, or Golden Land, wasn't part of the Zelda timeline before LttP. The story may seem familiar after all these years, but it was pretty fresh back in 92. I remember being really drawn into the story when I first played the game. The interaction with the NPCs in the game was also a first for the Zelda series. It was cool that the characters in the game had meaningful conversations with Link as opposed to the "It's dangerous out there, you'll need this." and the few phrases uttered by the characters in Zelda 2. You made the point about some puzzles being nearly impossible to solve, but there was always an NPC who had a vital clue to continue your quest. I don't ever remember a point where I got frustrated trying to solve a puzzle, and even the non-essential items could be found by talking to NPCs. I will give you that it could be frustrating when you had to fight through an entire dungeon to get to a boss, but that is one of the few problems I had with the game.
When I first played: yeah, I first played it more recently... emulation first, really, then the GBA version a year or so ago (never got around to finishing it). LA I've had for a long time of course, and OoT and MM I've also had for longer than LttP (and Oracles too... not sure about WW, though. Maybe, maybe not.). Of course, I'd seen many pictures of the game -- I read Nintendo Power for years! -- but hadn't played it.
By 'cliche story' I meant the basic concept: "save the princesses". Really, could it possibly get much more cliche (and tiresome) than that? They didn't even bother to make them look different, really... yes, the conversation (not new of course since RPGs had been doing that for a long time, but new to the series) and dark world and stuff are nice, but the basic idea? Not exactly innovative by any stretch of the imagination...
Quote:You made the point about some puzzles being nearly impossible to solve, but there was always an NPC who had a vital clue to continue your quest.
Yeah, if you can actually interpret that cryptic sentence... and that doesn't help you with the 'where'. I missed the spell you needed to open the dark world swamp dungeon, so I had absolutely no idea where to go or what to do... wandered around for quite some time. It was obvious I needed SOMETHING, but what? Who knows... I'd still be stuck there if not for FAQs, that's for certain. I'd NEVER have thought of looking on top of some random mountain near a dungeon I'd beaten a long time ago...
Quote:I will give you that it could be frustrating when you had to fight through an entire dungeon to get to a boss, but that is one of the few problems I had with the game.
As I said, they later realized this, and changed it for the later titles, thankfully... OoT has a dungeon structure closer to LA's than LttP's. WW is the same, if you ignore the fact that you almost never die. MM's are more linear, I felt, but certainly aren't close to LttP's structure... and like WW you don't die very often anyhow. The main problem is the clock.
Oh yeah! Exploring by examining your surroundings! The 3D games have some of that, but yeah it is fun to be able to check out drawers and things.