http://www.wired.com/news/politics/0,128..._tophead_2
Here's the important bit of this...
Quote:The bill would also permit people to use technology to skip objectionable content -- like a gory or sexually explicit scene -- in films, a right that consumers already have. However, under the proposed language, viewers would not be allowed to use software or devices to skip commericals or promotional announcements "that would otherwise be performed or displayed before, during or after the performance of the motion picture," like the previews on a DVD. The proposed law also includes language from the Pirate Act (S2237), which would permit the Justice Department to file civil lawsuits against alleged copyright infringers.
Essentially this means that companies can actually FORCE you to watch certain parts of things. You would not be ALLOWED to not watch certain parts of things, save for objectionable content as defined above (rather than how I define that phrase, anything that mildly annoys me, and "skip over" to me is defined as wiping out an entire species, or SET of species, because ONE of them happened to create the objectionable content). Now, being "forced to" be in the PRESENCE of ads is one thing. I don't find any objection with commercials being on the TV as I can just turn the channer or just plain ignore it. However, this opens the door to not even being able to walk out of the room. Under this whole thing, that could be taken as a measure to skip the commercials, which would be illegal.
Look, I'm SORRY that commercials don't work any more. I'm sorry no one wants to actually watch them and skip them at every opportunity. However, that's YOUR problem. You beam television into our houses for free, of your OWN choice. We didn't sign any contract with you, you just came up with a method to pay for it called advertising. I respect that to the extent the law requires, but you can't actually DEMAND anything from us since I don't recall EVER actually making any deals for this. Also, I'm sorry that people don't listen but it's mainly your fault what with the insulting and downright lying stuff you call advertisements. Maybe people would pay attention to the new products you are showing if you would actually go back to the original concept of advertising, which is, as you might guess from the WORD, only supposed to make people AWARE of stuff, not really outright convince them to get it! Also, notice that I'm apologizing here? Yes, it's in a condescending "well, that's not ACTUALLY apologizing..." way, but my point is maybe sometimes YOU freaks need to admit you screwed up.
I do NOT want entertainment turned into a clockwork orange scenario. I would NOT like to live in fear of every single electronic device there is just covering my head with a pillow until it all goes away... in different ways depending on how close I hold the pillow...
I mean, of ALL the ways to adapt copyright law to modern technology, this has to be the most "if we make it unbearable it will go away" approach possible. I mean, the next step after this would be a law against... the internet, it's very existance.
SCREW the survival of companies. Seriously, despite what some laws seem to say, they are NOT living people and don't have the right to existance! LET them die if they can't evolve. When it comes to companies, the weak SHOULD be crushed under the heal of the strong.
If I own the DVD I should be abled to decide to skip advertisement If I choose to, Otherwise were gonna have to go back to VHS! People who already disinterested enough to have too skip ads in dvds are not gonna go and pay attention to them weither you force them or not.
In television its understandble since thats how most tv stations survive if commericals are completely blocked out nobody sees them and channels will go bankrupt companies wont be keen on advertising on tv anymore ,Since digital cable has arrived which now allows people to skip past the advertisements on television.
To me why not allow people to pick what types of advertisements their interested in instead of bombarding them with repeated badgering enzyte comercials?
Quote:The report (.pdf) -- which covers copyrights, trade secrets, trademarks and patents -- also says that those who benefit most from this theft "are criminals, and alarmingly, criminal organizations with possible ties to terrorism."
Pfft! I dont see how Bin Laden would want to peddle the american godless infidel music and films! I think thats a reason he wants to kill us for our immoral entertainment.
The word "terrorism" can allow politicians do any kind of shit they want even if terrorism isnt neccesarrily involved.
Another despicable bill that goes even farther than previous ones in revoking the rights that people already have... actually they've already done that (it's legal to record a TV show on a tape and give a copy of the tape (or the tape itsself) to a friend but it's illegal to record a TV show with a TV-in card on your computer and give copies to other people? Huh?), but this is just another way they want to keep people from having any rights. I wonder how long it is until recording TV shows at all becomes illegal? You've got to buy the DVDs!
Oh yes, DVR systems will be outlawed by this thing, since the two main reasons to even get them are TV show recording and commercial skipping.
<img src="http://www.dilbert.com/comics/dilbert/archive/images/dilbert200411195094.jpg">
Something only vaguely resembling this, but it remarks on the idiocy of man.
If skipping commercials is outlawed then only outlaws will skip commercials?
Yeah, I agree this is stupid and, for all intents and purposes, uninforceable. What are the police going to do, come into your house and make sure that you're watching the previews? Not gonna happen. The best they can do is force the previews to play, but you can always mute the TV until the previews are done or go fix a sandwhich or go to the bathroom. Besides, I doubt the bill will get passed because of how incredibly dumb it is.
It's enforcable for most people. Just make it so that all DVD players cannot skip previews. Then you'd have to modify them or something to get them to skip those parts, and that'd be illegal so most people wouldn't do it. Same with recording -- simply make CD and DVD recorders illegal! Simple!
But stupid! Honestly, isn't this trampelling on SOME right we have? They make it clear that we already HAD the rights this bill gives us anyway. I think this is one of those unenumerated rights we as citizens totally have. Seriously, it's not piracy so much that threatens them (and yes, that IS wrong) so much as they themselves threaten them. Maybe if they stopped making terrible movies, music, television, and stuff like that people would actually be interested in purchasing that stuff. Maybe making actual GOOD stuff instead of following the cliche action movie/romantic comedy formulas 20 times a season in the theaters, creating 5 rap/"pop" songs for playback over and over for months at a time, and the constant barrage of reality shows almost every network is currently involved in (Discovery and TLC no longer support intelligence, but rather support you watching bike makers yell at each other for no good reason with not a hint of anything approaching intelligence to be found, thank all that is good for the Science channel which hasn't sunk down to that level yet). Oh, and listen up Sci-Fi and Lifetime. Making a movie a week is NOT something to be proud of. Consider the time constraints you MUST be under to do that and the actual quality of those recycled plots. Sorry, no more government conspiracy with aliens/powerful woman who stays with the man who beats her even though her male boss is beating her for doing that movies for you, start making REAL entertainment. And news, PLEASE stop caring about being entertaining! History channel, which in and of itself has started a slow decay (read: the completely lacking in any sort of fact checking "Conspiracy" series on that channel, I feel sorry for a channel otherwise good to suffer from such a show as that), happened to do a very revealing interview with a big name news host from long ago who happened to say what I have said, but with more clout, that the news organizations should have some frickin' dignity and realize their job isn't to entertain people, it's to inform them! If REAL news happens to be boring, well big deal! It's the truth and the truth in general doens't take story form!
All in all, try plucking the frickin' ALTERNATE PLANE OF TREES from your eye before brushing that bit of sawdust off our faces!
Quote:But stupid! Honestly, isn't this trampelling on SOME right we have?
Uh, isn't it pretty clear that it definitely is, and didn't my posts say that as well? Yes, it is restricting our rights. That seems to be the mission in life of groups like these... they want to increase their profits so all kinds of things that should be legal or currently are legal but hurt their income get tossed out the window by a pliant congress... both parties are guilty of this idiocy. I don't understand how they can legitimize a steady assault at the rights of their constituents, but it's really stupid. Sadly, I don't see this trend stopping anytime soon... I just wonder if we'll be able to do anything at all with any of our electronic devices by the time it's over.
Buy your hamburgers and SUVs and be happy, you stupid idiots. You're complaining that you already payed enough money for the DvD in the first place? Well, fuck you. Here's a message from our sponsers.
Honestly, I'm tired of constantly getting bombarded with ads. And television isn't the only place where ads are running constantly. Listen to the radio- ads. Go to work- ads both in the work place and on the way. Movies? Ads (not just previews anymore). The list goes on and on. (the satire/ comic transmetropolitan has a good take on ads among other things) One of the reasons why I don't watch tv and just buy/ rent dvds is BECAUSE of the ads on tv. These pricks treat tv shows and movies like packing peanuts between advertisments.
My two brains have slightly differing opinions on this matter:
#1: It's annoying to be forced to watch things unwanted.
#2: You have no rights as a recipient of entertainment. There is no God-given right to enjoy commercial-free CSI: New York. When something is offered to you, you use it within the boundaries the makers, et al, erect. You aren't being forced to watch anything. You have the right to turn off the TV and do something constructive like read a damn book.
Ryan Wrote:You have the right to turn off the TV and do something constructive like read a damn book.
books > tv x100000
Currently reading Dark Tower 5, great book. And no ads.
Quote:Currently reading Dark Tower 5, great book. And no ads.
Good man. I read the Dark Tower numbero uno about a month back - great book. I can't wait to read the rest. How's the series so far?
Just you wait, though. Pretty soon, they'll start placing ads in books a la magazines, and put them on the backs of pages with text so you can't rip them out.
Ryan, I think you forgot to read this.
They are saying you DON'T have the right to turn off the TV.
Before, we DID have the right to turn it off and read a book. Now, if we watch PART of it, we are now LEGALLY REQUIRED to watch ALL of it. We CAN'T turn it off.
Look, having requirements is fine, in the sense of "if you want the expansion pack, you must pay for it" or "if you want cable, pay for that too". This is clearly different. This is "hey, instead of the DVD being your property, now it's a contract, because the government says so, because we told them to, you can't own anything any more, now you are OURS, WATCH IT AND SMILE!".
Weltall, you can see the diff here right? This is clearly beyond the beyond.
Look at it this way. They beamed the television into our homes for free. We don't really have any right to tell them what content to put on the air. They are free to put whatever, commercials, you know whatever. However, they don't have the right to force us to watch JACK. You see, we not ONCE ever signed any contract. Not once did we enter into any agreement. By buying a monthly payed service for example you have an agreement and are bound to it, and you usually have to sign something to that effect.
They gave it to us for free, yes, but we never once actually signed any agreement. Not once did we say "okay, we will watch the commercials too, that's the agreement". We didn't even ASK for them to do it (most of us). As such, yes, they are free to decide what they broadcast as they own the station. That's just. However, in the reverse, they MUST understand that so long as they just send it out there free of charge, there are consequences, and one of them is that we are free to watch it in any fasion we so choose. They want to force us to watch the commercials, don't give it to us without making us sign a contract stating that that is the payment. That's all there is to it.
Sacred Jellybean Wrote:Good man. I read the Dark Tower numbero uno about a month back - great book. I can't wait to read the rest. How's the series so far?
Dark Tower 2 isn't as exciting as the rest- to me, at least. (that's not to say it isn't good!) Three and four is when the real fun happens, and the characters develop a lot more. I'm really enthralled in the book's universe at this point, I've also grown attached to the main characters. Great series.
@DJ: I think they're referring to skipping ads using devices such as TiVo, not turning off your tv.
Quote:viewers would not be allowed to use software or devices to skip commericals or promotional announcements
Dark Jaguar Wrote:Before, we DID have the right to turn it off and read a book. Now, if we watch PART of it, we are now LEGALLY REQUIRED to watch ALL of it. We CAN'T turn it off.
I'm sorry, but I fail to see how you get this out of being unable to skip commercials. I mean, on TV, you're pretty much stuck anyway and we have been for a half-century plus. This same idea has been a part of movie theaterdom forever as well. No one complains about it. On DVDs? Eh. If I actually watched movies on a regular basis, I guess I might care. the fact is, you are purchasing a movie as it is sold to you. If the studios say you have to watch these previews, dadgummit, you're going to watch them. It's their right to do that, because they can make these things however they want to. But you do have options. You can take the silent protest route, and mute or turn off the TV until the previews end. You can also choose not to buy these movies. If there were sharp financial repercussions from this decision, you know they'd stop it. THAT is the choice of the consumer. That is capitalism. If you simply can't live without the movie, then you watch it on their terms. If the idea bothers people so much, it's up to them to put their principles above their self-gratification. If they can't do that, they have no reason to bitch. That's how it is.
Ryan Wrote:On DVDs? Eh. If I actually watched movies on a regular basis, I guess I might care. the fact is, you are purchasing a movie as it is sold to you.
You have a point with that, but I just plain don't agree with the practice. (I can differentiate between you agreeing with them, and saying that they can do because it's technically theirs.) What these people in hollywood don't realize is that no one <i>has</i> to buy their dvds. It's a not a necessity, and if people have brains they won't keep buying the DvDs if they think the ads are such a pain in the ass.
Most DVDs actually don't force you to watch previews. VHS films did all the time (yes you could fast forward but i was still annoying), but if DVDs have trailers they usually don't make you watch them... but you do have to watch all those stupid warnings and intros and stuff and those are already often unskippable. Not nice.
Um Weltall, you aren't getting it.
This is about laws that say YOU MUST SIT THERE WITH YOUR EYES OPEN AND WATCH IT. This isn't hyperbole, this law LITERALLY says you MUST watch it and aren't ALLOWED to mute it. THAT is what I'm upset about. If they sell the DVDs with unskippable commercials, so be it, but LET me get around them if I find a way on my own. These laws say you can't act on your own to avoid them.
You think I'm saying they should go out of their way to make commercials skippable. No, I'm not (that's an issue of me just making a standard customer complaint). I'm against laws that say I am literally REQUIRED to watch the commercials or face penalties.
Of course you can mute it with either a mute button or by turning down the volume. You can also turn off the TV and wait for the menu to appear. This is about getting around ads by recording them on DVRs or the like. That's what it means... they cannot make it impossible to turn your TV off, that's for sure, and at least the TV as an independant volume control that has no connection to whatever the DVD player is doing.
And as I pointed out, the federal warnings are already usually unskippable on DVDs, and stay on the screen for quite some time. Trailers? Perhaps this would make putting trailers before DVD films more common, but as it is this is extremely uncommon on DVDs...
In those respects this law isn't hugely different. What its main impact would be is that it would be illegal now for DVRs to auto-skip ads. You could still skip them if you want to use a VHS recorder and hit 'record' every time it comes back from ads and 'stop' when it goes to an ad break (and I'm sure that they wish they could ban that too), but one of the main uses of DVRs -- avoiding advertising -- would be illegal.
Dark Jaguar Wrote:Um Weltall, you aren't getting it.
This is about laws that say YOU MUST SIT THERE WITH YOUR EYES OPEN AND WATCH IT. This isn't hyperbole, this law LITERALLY says you MUST watch it and aren't ALLOWED to mute it. THAT is what I'm upset about. If they sell the DVDs with unskippable commercials, so be it, but LET me get around them if I find a way on my own. These laws say you can't act on your own to avoid them.
You think I'm saying they should go out of their way to make commercials skippable. No, I'm not (that's an issue of me just making a standard customer complaint). I'm against laws that say I am literally REQUIRED to watch the commercials or face penalties.
Two things:
1: Nothing I saw in that article even hinted at, in even the vaguest terminology that I could see, the idea that you had to keep your eyes on the set during commercials or else. That's where I find the major contention with you here. You're right, I don't get it, because I can't find any evidence that what you're saying is a part of this bill. Maybe I'm blind, point it out to me.
2: Let's assume for a second that you're right, even literally. There's no way in hell it could possibly be enforced.
Quote:However, under the proposed language, viewers would not be allowed to use software or devices to skip commericals or promotional announcements "that would otherwise be performed or displayed before, during or after the performance of the motion picture," like the previews on a DVD.
That able to be interpreted that way? Basically it says Tivo is illegal, as is the menu button on your remote control, as is the scene selection. Sure, it doesn't specify it, but the companies can easily make this out to LOOK like it. One step after this is considering your eyelids "devices". Yeah, that's a bit too far, but you see exactly what this is saying right? It's saying that you are legally required to watch commercials, not just that they can put commercials you can't skip in DVDs or on TV, I mean they already do that.
By the way, cool avatar.
I have rented a few dvds that dont allow you to skip previews, That is competely retarded ,What if you owned the dvd for a number of years why still be forced to too see pontentially outdated advertising.Some let you skip others put the peviews in the Extras menu.
They stated they would let you skip violent or sexual explicit scenes what about being abled to skip sexually explicit advertising or questionable material! Big hypocracy there !You could be watching a family oriented program but get stinged with "sexual enhancement ads" or Some violent movie or video game ad being shown". Personally I love violence! But I hate seeing comericals for enzyte and Viagra or them genital herpies pills! :barf:
As for pirating ,I have no sympathy for the music industry! They overhcarge and gouge prices way to high , its not just because I go to the wrong stores, Its true you might save a few bucks but the average range is relatively the same. I go to just about any music store and I see a disk cd some of it isnt even recent music like Van halen being sold for 33 dollars!Geebus!The average price is 15-26 bucks but 30 isnt a uncommon amount.
In the 80's they said when the cds first came out they would bring the price down to 7 bucks like the records and cassettes, Once more started to make them .It never happend! Were still paying more then we should , Cds are cheaper to make today then ever but that has not stoped them.
The only cd I ever bought at a acceptable price is Kiss greatest hits for 7 bucks , but its only because Kiss isnt selling to good.
I thought they said were gonna lower prices after they started cracking down on file swaping? It doesnt look like it!
I havent fileswaped in a long time , Since the spyware and virus traffic was awful but I know many who still do,It really bugs up and lags your computer.
I have never taken pirated movies or games online, Since alot of time its poor quality and I dont get the maneuil and alot of games need cdkeys now.
Itunes doesnt sound to bad,If you think about it you could buy each song seperately it would probaily cost you less on Itunes then it would getting it retail. 12 songs at 99 cents each =rounded off is 12 bucks plus tax , If you get it at a store it could be 16-23 bucks plus tax. Interesting that I noticed they mentioned shutting down itunes, I guess since they dont want to have to pay us honnest prices and not rob us , They dont want compeition they want to keep their hogwash empires.
My cd burner is great if they ban I am still gonna keep on using it, I ask freinds if I can borrow their cds and I just burn off from them, I got Black Sabbath that way. Some I do buy I make another copy or transfer the data to my computer incase I lose the disc or if one of my freinds wants a copy.
Quote:That able to be interpreted that way? Basically it says Tivo is illegal, as is the menu button on your remote control, as is the scene selection. Sure, it doesn't specify it, but the companies can easily make this out to LOOK like it. One step after this is considering your eyelids "devices". Yeah, that's a bit too far, but you see exactly what this is saying right? It's saying that you are legally required to watch commercials, not just that they can put commercials you can't skip in DVDs or on TV, I mean they already do that.
Change TiVo so that it doesn't have an 'auto-skip-ads' function and it'd be illegal again. Making the Menu button or scene selection illegal? Um, what in the world? This has nothing to do with that! All it'd do is make those buttons inactive during the unskippable previews.
Soooo what are they gonna do if every time I see an ad I close my eyes, stick my fingers in my ears, and hum? Come in my house and put a gun to my head?
YES!! Hahaha, seriously though, this is retarded. But there's no way they'd ever be able to enforce most of this stuff.
Oh and depending on your dvd player every preview and FBI warning can be skipped.
UltraMarioMan Wrote:Soooo what are they gonna do if every time I see an ad I close my eyes, stick my fingers in my ears, and hum? Come in my house and put a gun to my head?
That remains of a stick death cartoon were a man is traped in a car forced to listen to beegees music and comits suicide rather then continue the torment!
Quote:Oh and depending on your dvd player every preview and FBI warning can be skipped.
On a lot of the DVDs I have you skip through all that junk.
On a semi-related not: I really hate DVDs that have a really long introduction that shows you random clips from the movie in the background while loading the menu in the foreground, generally taking a super long time and showing only clips that spoil the movie for you.
Somtimes it can be good , But for example the biggest annoyance is the starwars dvds were they have to show a little cartoon everytime you flip along the scene selection very annoying and pointless.
start up is ok the basic options are not a problem for me , Unless it has to play a 20 second clip before it lets do anything, Everything should have no more then 3 seconds of clips. Scene selections should have no clips or bells and whistles.
You can skip that thing by pressing the skip button, ASM...