From some forum... go to ve3d:
Quote:copied from a bunch of forums
Really, if you look a time line there is no point at which they could have restarted. Broussard used to say, "we switched engines a few times, started over a few times, we're late; sue us" or something along those lines. In reality, you can map DNF's progress onto a time frame fairly easily, and the only point at which they could've scrapped the project and started over was after the E3 2001 video. Here is the time line (now with highlighted points for your viewing pleasure):
Janurary 1997: Work on DNF started.*
April 1997: Quake 2 engine purchase announced. (they got it in mid-late 1997 before Quake 2 was released). Scott Miller states that he is confident that DNF will be released by mid 1998 and prey in late 1998 making 1998 a bit year for 3DR. He also mentions that his confidence is not misplaced.
August and September 1997: First screenshots in PC gamer (hummer, farmer i think).
May 1998: First DNF E3 video shown. You can see that a lot of work has been done.
Late 1998: 3DR announces switch to Unreal tech. It is expected to take no longer than 6 weeks and 3DRealms says "DNF is a 1999 game."
Mid 1999: 3DR admits that the engine switch took a lot more time than originally estimated.
Late 1999: 3DR announces upgrade to UT level tech. It is expected to take two weeks. 3DR releases a Christmas card saying that DNF will be released in 2000.
2000: I don't think anything happened. They released some sexy screenshots in late 1999/early 2000 (for the time). Broussard begins claiming that DNF development did not start until 1998. Inquiring minds wonder how they got so much done before May (E3) 1998.
May 2001: 3DR comes out of nowhere and puts DNF up at E3. They state that DNF will be released in 2001 and the end of the E3 2001 video says "WID in 2001". Many part of the video bear a clear resemblence to the 1999 screenshots.
October 2001: Broussard posts "sorry guys, it won't be a 2001 release" on the VE3D forums. "Don't worry, the last major hurdle is AI."
Unknown 2001: Broussard states that DNF will definitely be out before Unreal 2.
January 2002: Voodoo Extreme makes a list of top 10 titles to be released in 2002. #1 on that list is Duke Nukem Forever. Someone posts "when will we see something" in the 3DR forums. Broussard responds with "soon".
June 2002: The "soon" thread gets locked.
Unknown 2002: Broussard states that DNF will definitely be out before DooM 3.
2003: Broussard states that DNF has been "on track since early 2002" and that they haven't reached the light at the end of the tunnel, but "they finally found it." He wisps away the years between January 1997 and January 2002 and wishes people would consider DNF's development as if it started in 2002 (this is a strong hint that DNF was far from complete). Unreal 2 released.
Broussard adopts the "DooM 3 and HL2 will have been in development for 5 and 6 years when they're finally released -- DNF isn't taking that much longer" belief (notice: his numbers are very inaccurate).
Late 2003/early 2004: Take 2 complains about DNF development and expects it around "late 2005". "At this point we're just hoping the team [in garland] will finish the project."
2004: Broussard states that DNF development has been on track since "late 2002/early 2003", bumping up his earlier statement in an attempt to fight back release expectations. It is clear, from this behavior, that DNF will not be released this year or next. DooM 3 is released. Half Life 2's release is anticipated this year.
So the most reasonable points in which they could've completely restarted would've been after each of the E3 videos. They could've restarted after the E3 1998 video or after the E3 2001 video. Luckily, you can refute both of these possibilities by simply looking at what Broussard was saying back then -- the Unreal engine upgrade was certainly not expected to require them redoing much. Things were added and tech was changed, things were adopted. This was all stated in interviews with Broussard himself.
It is more difficult to question whether they've restarted at some point after E3 2001. Clearly, in late 2001/early 2002 when Broussard was saying that the last major hurdle was AI and "soon", he could not have just restarted the project. Furthermore, in 2003 he stated that development had been good since early 2002. If this was the case, then there was no point at which he could've restarted (unless you restart while telling fans "the last major hurdle is AI" and "soon").
* "We've actually been working on the game since January." -- Scott Miller, 1997.
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Video game systems that have been released in DNF's development time:
Neo Geo Pocket Color
Wonderswan
Dreamcast
Gameboy Advance
N-Gage
Playstation 2
X-Box
Gamecube
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Major releases in prominent game series since first DNF press release on April 25, 1997:
Grand Theft Auto 1, 2, London, III, Vice City, likely San Andreas
Fallout, Fallout 2, All eight (to my knowledge) Infinity Engine games and expansions, and three Baldur's Gate console spinoffs
Final Fantasies VII, VIII, IX, X, X-2 XI, Tactics, Tactics Advance, Crystal Chronicles, Origins, Anthology, Chronicles and the Ergheiz & two Mysterious Dungeon spinoffs
Legend of Zelda: Four Swords, Wind Waker, Ocarina of Time, Majora's Mask, Link's Awakening DX, Link to the Past GBA, Legend of Zelda GBA, Oracle of Seasons, Oracle of Ages
Unreal, Return to wherever the **** that was, Unreal Tournament, UT2k3, UT2k4 and at least 4 games off the top of my head that use its engine
Quakes 2 and 3, and God knows how many games used those two engines
Thief 1, 2, 3
The Sims and all seven expansions
Tony Hawk's Pro Skater 1, 2, 2x, 3, 4, Underground
Madden NFL '98, FIFA '98, NBA '98 and NHL '98 for the Super Nintendo, and NHL '98 for both the SNES and Genesis
Might & Magic VI, VII, VIII and IX
With the exception of Meridian 59, every MMORPG apart from MUDs (I may be off here; at any rate UO was released five months after DNF was announced)
Romance of the Three Kingdoms VI, VII, VIII, IX, Dynasty Warriors 1-4 (and 2 expansions), Samurai Warriors, Kessen 1 & 2, Dynasty Tactics 1 & 2, Mystic Heroes
Every Dance Dance Revolution game
Every single Pokémon game released in the US
Every Deer Hunter game
Chessmaster 5500, 6000, 7000, 8000, 9000 with 10th edition out in two months, just on the PC
Twenty (to my knowledge) Mega Man titles, for GBC, GBA, GC and N64, not including direct ports
Thirty (to my knowledge) Star Wars titles, again not including direct ports
And something new! Working Designs is famous for taking absolutely forever to release a product. Since the announcement of Duke Nukem Forever, WD has released Albert Oddesy, Magic Knight Rayearth, Sega Ages (maybe), Raystorm, Elemental Gearbolt, Lunar: Silver Star Story, Sillhouette Mirage, Lunar 2: Eternal Blue, Alundra, Arc the Lad Collection, Raycrisis, ThunderForce V, Vanguard Bandits, Silpheed and Gungriffon Blaze, with Growlanser Generations out in two months. Working Designs CEO Victor Ireland has made approximately 3,710 Usenet posts since the announcement of Duke Nukem Forever.
Also:
The Voyager 1 spacecraft has travelled approximately 2.5 billion miles since the announcement of Duke Nukem Forever.
The rovers Spirit and Opportunity were proposed, authorized, announced, designed, launched and successfully landed upon Mars within the timeframe of Duke Nukem Forever's development.
The majority of the children who were entering high school the school year following Duke Nukem Forever's announcemnt are now eligible to drink.
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Of the 21,400 Usenet posts concerning Duke Nukem Forever, here is one for every year.
April 30, 1997:
code:--------------------------------------------------------------------------------> Actually I guess it makes sense. The article talks about> Duke Nukem Forever coming out a year from now. By that> time the Quake engine will be old hat as far as id's concerned.> > I guess it just follows along with Duke staying one generation> of technology behind whatever id's latest product is.It will be using the Quake _2_ engine. Read the link next time.--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
October 6, 1998:
code:--------------------------------------------------------------------------------The other thing that crossed my mind is that we're officially in thePentium II age. Minimum requirements say's you need a P166-- goodluck. I've got a PII 266 with 64MB Ram and a Righteous I, and thething huffed and puffed. Ok, I like all my detail on and at least640X480 resolution. And with a PII, I expect my games to run assmooth as glass. It doesn't quite do that. With Half-Life and Sin andDuke Nukem Forever around the corner, future action games are gonnawant a PII. And since they feature 3dfx graphics why get them at allif you need to turn most of the detail off to play the game. (MaybeI'll just get a Voodoo II).--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
December 20, 1999:
code:--------------------------------------------------------------------------------My cable modem service sucks and UT netcode ain't great(****!!!!!!!!!! DUKENUKEM FOREVER MIGHT HAVE SUCKY ONLINE PLAY!!!!!)anyway, i tried out heat.The server i was one had like 5 people and i got pretty good ping. So youguys should try out HEAT with a low number of players and see how your pingis--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
December 12, 2000:
code:--------------------------------------------------------------------------------> What about Half-Life 2? Valve is being smart and keeping it on the QT, but> I think we will see HL2 by Xmas of 2001, which is sooner than we will see> TF2 or Duke Nukem Forever.Don't be so quick to write off Duke Forever. What many people fail torealize is that 3DRealms have quite a lot of cash flow from the consoleports and licensing of Duke. They're simply taking their time to finish thegame right. I'd look for it around September of next year provided itdoesn't come sooner. I'm using some tea leaves that have a little more kick.=)--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
October 10, 2001:
code:-------------------------------------------------------------------------------->what will be sooner released ? The new gn'r oder Duke Nukem Forever ? Or>will it be released in a bundle together ?From what I understand, the status of Duke Nukem Forever is in dire peril....the plot of the game involved protecting the president from assassination andalso some terrorist activities... which means the game will either be delayedat least a year in the interest of "good taste" or they'll have to totallyrewrite the storylines and stuff.--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
April 26, 2002:
code:--------------------------------------------------------------------------------Many of these will be out by xmas... I think the Xbox sales will go throughthe roof this xmas...> Rumored Killer Apps>> - Virtual Fighter X> - Neverwinter Nights> - World of Warcraft> - Warcraft III: Reign of Chaos> - Duke Nukem' Forever> - Doom III> - Return to Castle Wolfenstein> - Dues Ex 2--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
June 30, 2003:
code:--------------------------------------------------------------------------------> > If bandwidth is cheep to you, be sure to download the 600MB E3 movie of > > Half-Life 2 from fileplanet.com -- it's worth it, no question.> > It's going to be a good September when this new game comes out.> > I really hope so. Aside from Deus Ex 2, it's the only game I've really > looked forward to in years.I'm looking forward to Duke Nukem Forever, but only to see if they'll finish it. When they started making it, I put $50 under the mattress so I could buy it, but my mattress gives a pretty good interest rate, and now I've just decided to buy all of 3DRealms with the money, and FIRE EVERYBODY FOR BEING TOTALLY INCOMPETENT. Following that, I'll hire John Romero AND FIRE HIS ASS TOO, JUST BECAUSE I CAN.--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
March 24, 2004:
code:--------------------------------------------------------------------------------WTF? They don't owe you anything. They aren't hyping it. They aren't pushing out screenshots, movies and fake release dates. They're just quietly getting on with it, leave them be!And if that doesn't placate you, just think how good the strippers will look when it finally is released
Hahaha, how sad. By next year, it will have taken 3DRealms longer to make DNF than it has taken George Lucas to complete three new Star Wars movies.
At least 3D Realms stopped hyping the game years ago...
Still, there's no way in hell they're going to make back all of those millions that they've pumped into the game over the past nine years.
No, that is quite doubtful. And more doubtful the longer this thing drags on and on and on. And yes, Broussard does keep pushing up the date that they restarted and forward the release window. But I really do think that one of these years they'll finish it... it just seems like too much work and time by too good a team to truly be nothing. Will it be good? That's a different question and one we cannot answer right now because we know essentially nothing about the game as it currently is...
Imagine if they had been working on something ambitious like Fable. They'd probably take thirty years to develop something like that. DNF is just a standard shooter!
You know, to people who aren't actually reading our posts it may look like we're arguing. :D
It's actually kind of funny to read all that, but at the same time very sad...
A standard shooter sure, but Duke 3D was certainly more innovative than most 3d shooters... maybe they're trying to make it be like that. But it's a moving target and I see less that 3d shooters can innovate on so what they probably should be doing is just trying to finish it as a good game for some release time, not constantly change it or whatever it is that's making it take so ridiculously long... they could have finished several pretty good shooters in this amount of time! It'd only be truly worth the time if it ends up as a groundbreaking title, or at least one of the best FPSes ever, and I don't know if they realistically have a good chance at that. All that 3D Realms is really doing is burning cash and reducing intrest in their game. I mean, how long does it have to be one of the industry's biggest running jokes before when it finally DOES come out not many people care...
I've always liked Apogee/3DRealms and think that they're a good developer so I do think that they can make it a good game, but still... it's gotten pretty absurd.
What was supposed to be so innovative about it?
It was a few steps up from Doom, but I don't think Duke3D was really that innovative.
Great Rumbler Wrote:It was a few steps up from Doom, but I don't think Duke3D was really that innovative.
Visual and Audio really sucked , The Graphics were ok for its time , The sound effects were shit the voice overs were worse. But gameplay wise it was pretty good alot of the things you could do DukeNukem 3D you couldnt do in goldeneye, Kick in enemies with your foot, Blow up walls and walk through which is somthing rare even today,Smoosh enemies by closing sliding steel doors on them while they stand in the middle of the door war, Blow up entire buildings, shrink enemies into tiny insectoid sizes and walk over their bodies, Shrink yourself into mini Duke and go through secret passage ways you normally couldnt fit in, Pay stripers to show you their boobs,Interactive objects ,Interesting doodads and enviroments Including a tv showing the OJ simpson bronco chase. A huge variety of enemies and even boses,Cool weapons even Pipe bombs and remote controled detonaters,Lots of Humour and shock value, Surprisingly even a Build editor to make your own levels and you can get your own skins too, Even wierder the Borg are actually in this game when you play your edited levels and appear randomly on their own.
I would play DNF if it ever will be released, I think its funny they call it Duke Nukem Forever since it is taking forever for this Duke game to come out.
I was like 10 when this game was first announced close to 8 years later I am finnished High School or shall we say left it a year ago , Now dont piss on me about the grammar and calling me a child I know a freind who is older then me and is almost practically iliterate isnt even a teenager and still struggles to read a menu if he typed a message you might believe he was 5 years old.
Interactivity. You can interact with your environment to a much, much greater extent than any previous FPS that I know of. That was the main thing I was thinking of. Duke 3D also had a LOT more character from its main character than the ID titles, and was a pretty funny game... graphically Quake beat it, but in the little things Duke won.
Oh yeah, as ASM says the weapon selection was also great.
Yeah I thought Duke 3D was great. But what was supposed to be innovative about DNF?
I really don't know. Not anymore for sure... and as for years back, I didn't pay a huge amount of attention to the game so I don't remember. Anyway anything they were talking about in terms of innovation back in '98 has certainly been eclipsed by now!
Well.. what if the game was going to be SO innovative that other game companies would take about four HUNDRED years to be as innovative..
..then it.. wouldn't have..... been eclipsed by now... a total eclipse of the heart na na naaa..
Hey you should say something like "My GOD how could you SAY something like that, OB1! I'm never going to speak to you AGAIN!!!", since DJ will only see your post and think that I said something terrible.
Seriously, one of you do it. I mean this whole thing is very silly. Very immature. It's kinda like going around the house, covering your eyes and going "LALALALALA!" whenever that person you don't like enters the room. And it screws up the continuity in discussions.
OB1! How DARE you say something so infuriating?! I though that maybe I was your friend or something, but if this is how you treat your friends than ABF must be your best! Well, unlike ABF I'm not going to sit back and take it! You know what? I'm gonna put you on my ignore list, delete your name from my MSN Messenger list, and...and never you speak to you EVER again! EVER! I...I just can't believe you'd say that. You make me SO angry! I just cannot believe that YOU would say something like THAT to ME. I just can't. Don't bother trying to get someone to apologize for you, because I through dealing with and I'm through talking to you. I'm not even coming back to this thread anymore, I'm out of here. *leaves*
Haha, good job! *giggles*
The reason why DNF isn't out yet has been revealed!!! Turns out that--well, just read it for yorself! Prepare to be
shocked and
amazed!!
Quote:Hi folks,
I would like to introduce myself to you all, My name is Nicholas and obviously as you can see my nickname on this forum is honeyjigga, I used to be in the military and i had a great friend which i have not seen for over 10 years, and completely out of the blue he phoned me last night while i was enjoying a night in in front of the TV. We spoke and i was so happy to talk to him, i suddenly thought to myself how did he get my number because i am ex directory. Then i remember thinking to myself when we were back in the army he always told me that he wants to work in the government, and i thought maybe he used some government information to track me down. So i asked him if he did this and he said 'yeah how did you know that' and i said 'well you told me all those years ago about how you wanted to work in the government' and 'he said you remembered about all this' and i said 'of course why should i forget', he said 'you have an incredible memory', because other people's memory's fade especially when you been in the army under all that fire power within training, anyway i asked him to meet up straight away, so we met up for lunch 2 days later and then he came around my house and stayed the night we just chilled out, then i introduced him to my computer and told him how i love playing first person shooters. Ii showed him Far Cry and he was blown away, and then he told me how he loves virtual reality and he said he owns one of those stereoscopic virtual head mounted displays by i glasses 3D and i thought wow i want to try that, he said he is interested in all types of games and i mentioned to him that the one game i want to play is Duke Nukem Forever and he said 'oh i want that game like so badly' and he said 'but i have to tell you something',
'remember to keep it to your chest like the old days of military secrets and i said of course scouts honour, we were in the scouts before the military but its like the same thing to say that’s for keeping secrets. He told me that Duke Nukem Forever looks set to never be released or not till when we are ready. First i thought what the hell is he talking about but i said go on, he says
It all started out as this, the United States Government, and the British government approached 3D Realms back in 1996, and spoke to George Broussard about the development of a new game which would be government funded, the team at 3D Realms decided to have their own engine made from the ground up, but the government said no we want an existing engine to be totally modified, and used for this game.
We also want a highly advanced game, with incredible looking graphics, A.I. and a style of game play that has never been done before, it needs to be the most interactive and atmospheric game to be made ever in history and we don't care how long it takes, we want it to be perfect. The game is to be about aliens and alien technology, plasma guns, laser guns, and very scary.
'They said that this is going to be based on real life'. Now that baffles me, that all this time the team at 3D Realms knows about the alien cover up and they have not told the general public, they must have signed some special NDA agreement, or more like speak and your dead agreement, you know what length the government goes to stop anyone from knowing the truth.
More of what my friend said. 'As the years went by in developing they had to stop development for a while, remember they changed engines, it was a lot of work to make it based on real life.
Now why all the trouble well, my dear friend continued,
He said his role has been dis-information, he said that Duke Nukem Forever cannot be released because simply us Humans are not ready for this kind of game that deals with alien civilisations, he says that’s why perhaps the name implies it, Duke Nukem Forever meaning forever and ever it won't be released until we are ready. He also told me that
the government simply will never say why we have known about the alien crashing at Roswell for over the past half century, and how they back engineer the flying saucers.
Instead he said that maybe someday when we are ready they will release the game so we can play it and then we would make up our own minds about alien life in the universe or universes as shall i say. Then simply the aliens will come and land on the White House Lawn, but the government will never tell us that they have known about it, its just there getting us ready for it, so instead of releasing the game too soon, they have been bombarding us with all the latest TV shows, to movies and documentaries on alien life, and UFOS and Area 51.
This comes to why George Broussard always said this when we have asked when will the game be released, he says 'when were ready' now you know folks, when were ready, it's been there staring us blank in the face all this time.
I am mystified by all this but my friend is truthful, who put his life in risk to save the lives of many and worked in the military and swore an oath to protect his country and he did this for the Untied States of America , so we owe him our heart and life, as maybe once i have finished writing this information that he has told me and that i have leaked to the internet then the government will do what they do best and cover up their tracks by sending the Men In Black to do their dirty work and assasinanate him for leaking out vital information of the biggest cover up in history.
I was never a believer of aliens but turned to be a believer, we must take this information, investigate it and believe it or we will never learn a thing about life.
Yours Nicholas and peace, the aliens are coming and we must prepare for it
source:
http://www.filerush.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=941
Hahaha, I love it how he's totally okay about his friend dying at the end.
Best reason for DNF's delay I've heard yet! Certainly more convincing than anything Broussard has told us.
Aliens? That's awesome... :D
But seriously, I really do like 3DRealms... it's too bad that this game seems to be giving them so much trouble.
They switch engines every year because they see a new game come out that look better than DNF. It's an endless cycle.
Sadly, that seems to be a big part of the problem... they want modern graphics, but having to continually redo the engine causes big delays. Which cause content delays, which cause them to get into the next graphic engine cycle...
We probably could have gotten two or three new Duke Nukem FPS's in the past nine years if they hadn't switched the engine so many times.
Two, at least, for sure. And that's with reasonably long three or four year development cycles.
Yeah... but I think that when it finally DOES come out it'll probably be pretty good.
It better be.
It'll be the first game ever to use nostalgia for its own self as a selling point. :D
Quote:hat was the main thing I was thinking of. Duke 3D also had a LOT more character from its main character than the ID titles,
Just don't tell Ash about Duke's copycating... *Watches Army of Darkness*
The comedy continues! From Gamespot.
Quote:Besides revealing a cornucopia of Grand Theft Auto details, yesterday's Take-Two Interactive call also mentioned 3D Realms' legendarily delayed shooter, Duke Nukem Forever. In the question-and-answer session that followed the company's earnings call, Take-Two CEO Rich Roedel fielded a question from UBS analyst Mike Wallace. The exchange went like this:
Wallace: "And then just one more [question] for fiscal '05. Is Duke Nukem [Forever] in the plan?"
Roedel: "No, it is not in any of the guidance that we've given."
Wallace: "OK. And should we just completely forget about this product by now or...?"
Roedel: "Absolutely not, although it has been frustrating in terms of committing to a ship date. But the 3D Realms guys continue to work. They are using the Doom 3 technology, which is finished. They are a premier developer, but they certainly believe in no line before it's time. So they want to deliver a great game, and we are anxiously waiting for updates from them."
If true, the Doom 3 engine would have been at least the third engine used by Duke Nukem Forever. When the game was first announced in 1997, it was to use the Quake II graphics engine, also from id Software. Then, in 1998, the Texas-based developer announced that the game would use Epic's Unreal engine instead.
[UPDATE] However, it now appears Roedel's official statement to the press was in error. An item on Shacknews today from 3D Realms' George Broussard flatly denies the Doom 3 engine will be used. "We are not using the Doom 3 engine for Duke Nukem Forever," he said. However, Broussard and other 3D Realms employees declined GameSpot's repeated requests to comment on why the head of Duke Nukem Forever's publisher would make such a public mistake.
So now it will be out 2025 instead of 2050?
Game of the Year 2381. Remember, you heard it here first.
